DIY Fuel injection thread.

[shrike]

1 hour ago, HumberSS said:

So school me on this shit. On the 4V in the Dyna I'm weighing up the idea of a speeduino efi conversion. Maybe a future project once running, or maybe before.. my reasons are that I need a set of plug leads, which will set me back a few hundy, and the carb needs a rekit. After which it will still be a leaky carb.. ive previously discovered 2zz toyota coils fit perfectly (conveniently also dirt cheap and common), and was thinking I'd drill/weld bosses to factory manifold for the injectors. Might do this anyway to give the future option if i dont commit immediately. I'd have to run wasted spark, and apparently I wouldn't need cam phasing due to it being a wasted spark v8. So crank trigger and throw the dizzy away? And how many teeth? Curious as to best injectors (300hp would be ambitious for this donk). I like the idea of being able to tune for economy rather than outright power, no shitty fuel seeping carb and associated smells, and all-weather consistent running. I don't like the scope creep, but am entertaining nonetheless. Hardware wise it appears simple, of course the devil will be in the detail. Fuel pump and delivery setup recommendations also welcome. Speeduino recommendations? TPS? MAP? Throttle body or just gut the carb and use?? Apologies for naivety.

Id be trying to get a set of 12hole injectors around the 320cc range

The 1GRFE injectors Denso 23209-39075 are 320cc should be pretty easy to get (you can also bump the fuel pressure up if you need some more headroom)

With it being an older V8 id be wanting some head room but an injector calculator recons you can get away with circa 250cc (80% duty) so 70cc should be plenty of headroom

[kws]

On 14/10/2024 at 18:26, yoeddynz said:

Definitely go for a 36-1 trigger wheel. Run wasted spark and batch injection and even the basic Speeduino will still give you the ability to tune the lot to run way better than any carb will.

Its all basic stuff and once you get stuck in its super fun to learn and quite addictive to keep striving for an even better tune.

Have a chat with @kws about Speeduino. He's been down that road already.

I still think there's better support for megasquirt and more information on a wide variety of setups. Both platforms utilise the same tuning software.  So keep a look out for megasquirt deals.

 

I can't comment on MS, since I've not used it, or the current state of Speeduino since it's been a few years for me, but having poked around in my blog posts from when I was playing with it, goddam it was good fun and really hit me in the nostalgia feels. I'll do it again at some point; I still have a spare Speeduino and most of the bits required to make something run on it, I just haven't had the right car.

I can concur with the above recommendation regarding the trigger wheel, batch injection and wasted spark. It's almost comical how easy it is to get that setup to work, and in my case, run and drive better than the old Lucas EFI right out of the box. I probably wouldn't bother building one like I did nowadays, not when it's so easy to get a nicely built off the shelf unit with a housing and everything; I think one was linked a couple of pages ago.

If you want to have a dig through what I did, its all here, https://tasteslikepetrol.net/category/projects/speeduino/page/2/  and https://tasteslikepetrol.net/category/projects/speeduino/

[Muncie]

Quick question if you need to feed throttle in to get a car to start what's going on? Too much fuel at crank??

[BlownCorona]

Do you have an IACV? Might need to open that up a touch at cranking 

[Muncie]

On 19/10/2024 at 13:09, BlownCorona said:

Do you have an IACV? Might need to open that up a touch at cranking 

As in foot to floor as soon as it catches it will idles fine im not sure IAC will react fast enough also really scared of IAC tables it has more tables than the MAF.

[GARDRB]

Ok, looking at dipping my toe into the world of aftermarket ECUs since I've sold a car, have the money kicking around, and the factory ECU is getting a bit sad.

I've got a UCF20 1UZ in a CE71/KE70 Corolla wagon.

I've found what I consider a good deal on a Link Storm G4+, which looks to be the first of the black case ECUs?

I understand that I should switch from stepper motor idle control to a solenoid. I'm gonna need an IAT. Can I use a Toyota IAT or do I need a Link or similar one?

Is Spartan still the go-to for a wideband controller? Do I blank my narrowband sensors and run a wideband after the merge in my exhaust, or do I keep the narrowband sensors in there too?

To start with, I don't really want to build a whole new loom, so I'm thinking I'll run the twin distributor setup over going to individual coils and coils can be a future project.

I'd be getting it tuned by our favourite 1UZ guru @kpr at Garage1uz if he will have me in his shed, but I'm guessing I can get a semi-decent tune into it through hassling @RomanDave and that the Link software can give me a semi decent base map?

Anything else I need to consider? @Dudley is trying to sell me a Link G3 that he probably got off @Stu for a gobby and a reach-around, but I like the idea of having a slightly more modern ECU and the 8 injector and ignition outputs feel nice and future-proofy.

Thoughts/Feels/likes/prayers?

[Roman]

If you get canbus based wideband controllers, you can run one in each bank and read from them both.
Then this way you also dont use up any of your precious analog inputs, annnndddd its way more accurate.

G4+ is pretty good but honestly wouldn't recommend going older than that.
As the software is a bit more janky and you'll grow into some of the features that are in G4+ but not earlier models. 
Idle speed correction isnt a huge deal really, but yeah get rid of the stepper based one. 

You can calibrate any sort of IAT to work, same goes for MAP etc.
However I've got a favorite that has good fast response and they cost nearly nothing. Dont go paying $100 for an IAT sensor, they are literally just a 0.005c thermistor with some plastic bits to hold it in the air stream.



 

[kpr]

If I recall correct the twin plug storm has 8 injector drives and will run sequential,  but batch fire isn't the end of the world like  some people think

Throw away the narrow band o2's, having wide band on board is nice to have, but isn't 100% necessary. Makes it easier for your tuner.....

[mjrstar]

I think my last exposed bulb style iat sensor was from a BMW or maybe audi at pickapart. Came with a nice baseplate and I chopped back a bit of wiring along with the plug.

 

This has got me thinking,  my honda has oem slow response thing, and I noticed it heat soaks passed 40 deg on a mild sub 20 degree day, and takes ages at wide open throttle (like minutes) to start showing a more reasonable temp. As my catalogs from my last event shown.

Is there hp left on the table by not accurately measuring iat on a stock ecu? My thoughts are being n/a then probably not..

 

Also can I bung a resistor in instead of my iacv now that I have blanked it off. Of course I'd need something in there to ensure the ecu doesn't get upset.

[Roman]

8 minutes ago, mjrstar said:

Is there hp left on the table by not accurately measuring iat on a stock ecu? My thoughts are being n/a then probably not..

 

If it's MAP based, then IAT decently contributes to the airmass calculation. But if it's MAF based then IAT does hardly anything. 

Maybe you could wire in a potentiometer, so you can adjust it and see if you make any gains. haha

[mjrstar]

1 minute ago, Roman said:

If it's MAP based, then IAT decently contributes to the airmass calculation. But if it's MAF based then IAT does hardly anything. 

Maybe you could wire in a potentiometer, so you can adjust it and see if you make any gains. haha

It is indeed running MAP, not airflow meter.

The other thought I had was to bung it into the intake pipe maybe quite close to the airfilter instead of on one of the runners right near the head.

[GARDRB]

1 hour ago, kpr said:

If I recall correct the twin plug storm has 8 injector drives and will run sequential,  but batch fire isn't the end of the world like  some people think

Throw away the narrow band o2's, having wide band on board is nice to have, but isn't 100% necessary. Makes it easier for your tuner.....

ideally I want my tuner to be as happy as possible. I hear a pie and V keeps him pretty happy though

[Dudley]

Throw your stinky ecus away slam a dizzy and Holley 650 double pumper on it and call it a day

[GARDRB]

13 minutes ago, Dudley said:

Throw your stinky ecus away slam a dizzy and Holley 650 double pumper on it and call it a day

[shrike]

2 hours ago, Roman said:

If you get canbus based wideband controllers, you can run one in each bank and read from them both.
Then this way you also dont use up any of your precious analog inputs, annnndddd its way more accurate.

G4+ is pretty good but honestly wouldn't recommend going older than that.
As the software is a bit more janky and you'll grow into some of the features that are in G4+ but not earlier models. 
Idle speed correction isnt a huge deal really, but yeah get rid of the stepper based one. 

You can calibrate any sort of IAT to work, same goes for MAP etc.
However I've got a favorite that has good fast response and they cost nearly nothing. Dont go paying $100 for an IAT sensor, they are literally just a 0.005c thermistor with some plastic bits to hold it in the air stream.



 

What kind of plug do those sensors use? are they a deutsch plug?

[kpr]

1 hour ago, GARDRB said:

ideally I want my tuner to be as happy as possible. I hear a pie and V keeps him pretty happy though

Generally to keep your tuner happy as possible.  you want to leave your car at home, drop them off a large sum of cash, along with that V and pie, then leave.  

[Dudley]

The tuner I use likes a hearty feed from gull, the more stale the food the better

[bigfoot]

My lancer is running a g4+ atom. I have a air temp sensor from a commodore and a map sensor from a celica or something similar. Fairly easy to find at pick a part. Managed to tune it myself with guidance from @Roman, I shoyld probably pay a visit to @kpr at some point

[Roman]

2 hours ago, shrike said:

What kind of plug do those sensors use? are they a deutsch plug?

Woops, didnt notice the plug on that one. 

I use the ones that use an EV1 (injector) plug 

https://vi.aliexpress.com/item/1005006120877474.html

[Roman]

45 minutes ago, bigfoot said:

My lancer is running a g4+ atom. I have a air temp sensor from a commodore and a map sensor from a celica or something similar. Fairly easy to find at pick a part. Managed to tune it myself with guidance from @Roman, I shoyld probably pay a visit to @kpr at some point

You should, I bet you've got a lot of power hiding in your ignition table at the moment.