yoeddynz Posted June 18, 2014 Author Share Posted June 18, 2014 Oh sweet. Yeah thats better.. I was doing it via phone and numpty level of skill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpr Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 I reckon you should just go for it. Anything is possible with a little digging and tinkering. Very satisfying! Edit : my ms worked sweet as with the factory mazda vr sensors. 36-1 trigger wheel. But im taking it that kpr is referring to cam angle sensors? was just pointing out they wont work too well with some factory setups, many are sure to work fine. they tend to be more picky than other ecu's. the ms3 i had, i had to move the vr sensors closer the trigger wheel to get a rpm reading at cranking speed. had to have the vr sensor super close to the wheel and good cranking speed for it to start. it also always had an intermittent missfire at a certain rpm. both problems were on a previously untouched cas, that have been running perfect on a link. no rpm at cranking was due to the voltage being to low for the ms. at the time there wasn't any way to lower the arming voltage in the ms software. the intermittent miss seemed to be something fairly common after talking to a few people. extra circuitry/ daughter boards will fix the above problems. have used the zeal daughter board in ms1/2 and both worked good. i thought the ms3 would be an advantage over ms1/ms2 and work without the extra's. but had same issues. im not saying don't do it. you may get lucky and it'l work first go, but be prepared to research and spend some time on it, if it doesn't. with the likes of link etc thats what you are paying for, someone has done all the hard work and shit just works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingbrick Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 Hi David. I assembled my ms2 many years ago. No problems with information or assembly and found the whole process thoroughly enjoyable in every way. Make sure you get a stim. Also.. I haven't read most of what the others said but don't save 20$ by buying an older model. Get the latest and most fully featured one you can find. Now. I spoke to a turner the other day about these and his opinion was that they are a brilliant educational tool BUT he was adamant that the components used are simply not as precise as those used in the link and other ecus. He probably doesn't have experience with the later units but sees shit from that guy in tga. He reckons that even if you had the largest table in the world the guts will still have an inherent inaccuracy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoeddynz Posted June 19, 2014 Author Share Posted June 19, 2014 But still streets ahead of many factory ecus in so many ways. It would be interesting to have a proper lecky geek who really knows his electronic gubbins to see how the base components compare against say link etc. I feel from what I have read that many tuners out there don't so much hate MS because its base quality but more the fact they see so many bad installs with badly chosen mismatched components done on tiny budgets that they have fix before they can even attempt to tune the engine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eke_zetec_RWD Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 . I feel from what I have read that many tuners out there don't so much hate MS because its base quality but more the fact they see so many bad installs with badly chosen mismatched components done on tiny budgets that they have fix before they can even attempt to tune the engine. This exactly. Also dyno guy can't just quickly ring ms up and quiz them on random issues like you can with link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 What do we know about Alpha-N tuning? Namely what is the best way to do it without a dyno? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 You just go hoon it down the road and adjust the cells according to what the wideband says man. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 Yes, I get that part, just wondering it there it any traps for young players? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Testament Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 as long as we start rich and keep the timing on the low side until the fuel is dialed in its probably fine. heck its a kent, what does it matter just set it on kill to start with. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 Quiet in the cheap seats Tommy-no-tune... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Testament Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 its exactly as i said man. just haven't finished dialing the fuel in. Trust me, I know what I'm doing 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpr Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 ain't much different to tuning in other modes, as others said. fuel map will look look a bit different at low throttle. fuel will fall away with revs at same throttle opening, where is a map setup will be more flat //oldschool.co.nz/index.php?/topic/34850-diy-fuel-injection-thread/page-4#entry989676 main thing is to keep timing low. till get afr right. even if its too lean, with low timing its just gonna be a slug, not blow up 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark105 Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 You just go hoon it down the road and adjust the cells according to what the wideband says man. This. Skyline is alpha n and tuned this way. Start rich and dial back as per wide band. Skyline burns the plugs nicely. If you want it pretty perfect you can just run wide band full time with target tables so it perfects it's self but don't turn target tables on until you get a good initial tune. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoeddynz Posted September 29, 2014 Author Share Posted September 29, 2014 Wideband is in my dash and on all the time. I love them pretty numbers and i can always then spot any areas I want to fiddle with.. when no one's looking 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0R10N Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 I'm currently having a discussion with a workmate about fitting 560cc injectors to my TX3 track car (running a Link G1 V5). He says they are way too hueg for a 1600cc - and I suppose he does have a point, since I had a few issues with the idle and acceleration enrichment on my other TX3, which runs slightly smaller 510cc injectors on the same 1600cc engine and same ECU (Link G1 V5). My opinion is that it won't be much more difficult if I simply narrow the pulse width a bit further and aim for a flatter fuel curve. But the obvious shortcoming is that there won't be enough resolution in the fuel map. Or should I just wait for some 510cc to pop up, as I already have all the values from my other TX3 as a guide? Or should I just get 450cc ones for less overhead but possibly better fuel map resolution? The current 390cc ones are maxed out at 100% duty cycle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 Get some id1000s. On a serious note, just keep upping the boost until you use the bigger injectors/ they will be fine. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 Yea I wouldn't stress 510's over 560's, Ignore your workmate and get what is easy/affordable right now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0R10N Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 Yup just went with my gut and whacked a bid on. Pretty cheap, under $150 for the 560cc ones (if I win them) and I have no idea if any 510s are gonna pop up in the next few weeks. Want the car running for drag day! I suspect the whole stigma with hueg injectors on smaller engines is a hangover from the days when people used to chuck them in cars running standard ECUs, and they would predictably run like a bag of shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Testament Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Was just tidying in the shed last night and found I have 560cc and 450cc in my shed which I forgot about and am probably never going to use, if you don't win those ones I'm sure we can figure something out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Yup just went with my gut and whacked a bid on. Pretty cheap, under $150 for the 560cc ones (if I win them) and I have no idea if any 510s are gonna pop up in the next few weeks. Want the car running for drag day! I suspect the whole stigma with hueg injectors on smaller engines is a hangover from the days when people used to chuck them in cars running standard ECUs, and they would predictably run like a bag of shit. I think it's more to do with difficulty in controlling super small pulsewidths? As in, your ECU cannot control below 2% opening time. (for example) That might be fine for 350cc injectors as 2.5% pulsewidth gives you correct idle. But 560cc might need 1.5%, which your ECU cant do. Or whatever. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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