Muncie Posted April 29 Share Posted April 29 Hi All I've had an idea to add some strain gauges into my rear suspension to give torque readings while road tuning so I can go one better than just the yup that feels faster scenario I would be using otherwise. Ideally I'd feed it into the ecu but I think I may be running out of capacity on mine. What else could be used (cheaply) to monitor a mv/v signal that could maybe give a dashboard readout on a screen with live or peak data readout? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted April 30 Author Share Posted April 30 Plan would Involve 2 of these one on each side to give a total torque figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickJ Posted April 30 Share Posted April 30 I messed about with them a few years ago to measure dynamic loads and gave up when the costs got out of control Maybe modifying one of the arms to include a commercial load cell for testing might be workable? "Cheapest" option I found for reading a strain gauge was from harvesting loadcell read outs but the read time was 1Hz or static load only range For 1kHz+ read, labview hardware was better, but then in the $2k range to set up. Keen to hear what options come about, must be some diy way to hook them up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted April 30 Author Share Posted April 30 I used to be the distributor for Delphi Mantracourt so can get their gear but it expensive formula 1 use it..... I'm wondering if a oscilloscope app could be used to just record the voltage and compare against the data from ecu. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h4nd Posted April 30 Share Posted April 30 https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.magicmotorsport.dynoroad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nominal Posted April 30 Share Posted April 30 What happened to those gTech (?) doodads that used to be around to measure performance? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tortron Posted April 30 Share Posted April 30 They were made by Tesla did ya know. Presumably thr name was bought out. Modern phones probably have thr same if not better sensors in them now, some of the apps seem quite popular on the YouTube 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjrstar Posted April 30 Share Posted April 30 On 30/04/2024 at 11:26, Muncie said: Hi All I've had an idea to add some strain gauges into my rear suspension to give torque readings while road tuning so I can go one better than just the yup that feels faster scenario I would be using otherwise. Ideally I'd feed it into the ecu but I think I may be running out of capacity on mine. What else could be used (cheaply) to monitor a mv/v signal that could maybe give a dashboard readout on a screen with live or peak data readout? I'd save a lot of messing around and just go straight to the @Roman approved virtual dyno app, it makes the graphs so you don't have to. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Posted April 30 Share Posted April 30 Yeah ultimately what you are trying to measure is rate of acceleration. Since the mass of the vehicle is fixed, being able to accellerate this at a given rate is a fairly good indicator of your power level. Do you have any logging capabilities with your ECU? Virtual Dyno really is amazing, but you have to constrain all of the variables really well. One problem that even virtual dyno has, and it's way less sensitive to this than a strain gauge - Is that any bumps in the road need a heavy degree of filtering. If you were monitoring load on a driveshaft or suspension part or whatever, you're going to have an incredibly poor signal to noise ratio. If you've got a few bucks to spend, have a look at Dragy. I've seen some friends run these at the drags and have some results back that are insanely close to their actual quarter mile times. https://dragymotorsports.com.au/ The main thing about road testing though is you have to try constrain every variable possible, as much as possible. Not so necessary on a dyno when the car just sits there, more or less. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h4nd Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 I bought a standalone Accel based hp meter for my bro, to aid with tuning his jet-boat. Not sure he ever used it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickJ Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 21 hours ago, Roman said: One problem that even virtual dyno has, and it's way less sensitive to this than a strain gauge - Is that any bumps in the road need a heavy degree of filtering. If you were monitoring load on a driveshaft or suspension part or whatever, you're going to have an incredibly poor signal to noise ratio. This is where my plans all fell to pieces, could rig up the oscilloscope to read the strain gauges fine but the signal to noise was such that I then had to export the wave form and apply software filters to fully interpret the data which was not really in the scope of opensource, easy or cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickJ Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 I still have some strain gauges left over if you want some to have a play with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted May 1 Author Share Posted May 1 Hmm If I was going to try it would need a fairly consistent smooth road to give it beans on. Like perhaps an airfield or drag strip I think i can handle that. Find a way of filtering the data a bit harder, I think I may get in touch with Mantracourt and see what they recommend a Bluetooth module is about $500 from them and gets access to some very powerful and software. Hardest part would be calibration though accuracy isn't overly important I just want to be able to see a graph where I can figure out if I made more torque than last run after tuning tweaks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cletus Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 Could the strain gauge go in the engine mount? Would that lessen the wonky readings from bumps etc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
440bbm Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 with that investment is it not that far off just going to a dyno for a day. seems stupid to put 500 and a whooooole bunch of your time into making it all work to somethign thats half assed anyways. when a day on dyno be 1k or whatever and your done. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted May 1 Author Share Posted May 1 Yeah it realistically could probably the subframe under the mount 3 minutes ago, cletus said: Could the strain gauge go in the engine mount? Would that lessen the wonky readings from bumps etc? Could be a good location thinner metal more deflection so may yield a wider range of readings. I like your thinking there. For background i used to Install these on machines like lifting davits and forklifts to give live data to the operator on the loading. I've now twigged it could be useful for tuning and wonder what automotive monitoring equipment might be suitable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted May 1 Author Share Posted May 1 4 minutes ago, 440bbm said: with that investment is it not that far off just going to a dyno for a day. seems stupid to put 500 and a whooooole bunch of your time into making it all work to somethign thats half assed anyways. when a day on dyno be 1k or whatever and your done. I hear you for sure it may go to a dyno initially to get the driveablity sorted but I want to develop further afterwards. If im able to set up some of the dyno features in the car I can use those as engine protection later on. In theory could be a cheap way for others if it works strain gauges are cheap and give good information once you can read it through software im just wanting a non commercial solution to it so it's affordable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vk327 Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 best DIY option is probablly an arduino something like this sort of setup https://thecavepearlproject.org/how-to-build-an-arduino-data-logger/, could setup code to run engine protection output with a kill relay or intercept the IAT signal and setup the delco iat table to pull timing etc at a set value, IIRC fault value open circuit they default the -40deg row with a bit of messing around would be able to piggyback off data like tps maf and rpm to have the whole lot logged in one package. most of the commercially available loggers are getting up into aftermarket ecu territory any way, so would be money better spent on an ecu upgrade with the added benefit of onboard logging 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpr Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 Other than ignition timing changes. All you need to look at is afr and injector duty cycle, same afr and more injector duty = more power. isn't many cases when this isn't true. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrike Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 5 minutes ago, kpr said: Other than ignition timing changes. All you need to look at is afr and injector duty cycle, same afr and more injector duty = more power. isn't many cases when this isn't true. @Muncieshould do a roadtrip to see KPR :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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