Yowzer Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Sooo... Plans for an engine I have lying around involves building up a 5/7M-GTE (5M head, 7M block and turbo) Obviously gonna need an aftermarket computer of some sort to get the most out of it, but I have very little knowledge of the ECU world. Don't need anything overly flash and state of the art, but I do like features. If those of you in the know can give me a rundown on some different systems and what they can do, (and a rough price) that would be mint. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Sooo...Plans for an engine I have lying around involves building up a 5/7M-GTE (5M head, 7M block and turbo) Obviously gonna need an aftermarket computer of some sort to get the most out of it, but I have very little knowledge of the ECU world. Don't need anything overly flash and state of the art, but I do like features. If those of you in the know can give me a rundown on some different systems and what they can do, (and a rough price) that would be mint. Cheers I suspect fishtailfred will have some good input here. www.diyefi.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UTERUS Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 From the last chat i had with Fredulator, it's a bit far off from being totally stand alone. But he will be able to be more specific on the goings on Keep an eye on tardme for an old link, i saw a G1 for $300 awhile ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yowzer Posted March 29, 2010 Author Share Posted March 29, 2010 Yeah Link is what I was leaning towards. Something with duel maps would be cool, one for cruise, one for towing/skids Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemi Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Yeah Link is what I was leaning towards.Something with duel maps would be cool, one for cruise, one for towing/skids this is what i would want . like nissan ecu is pretty tunable but getting the writer and programme to do so . i dunno where . must look into it more as i have 4 ca18de/t ecu's lying around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpr Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 if you buy an old link (pre g3) make sure its setup for your engine. else will have to be sent back to link to be reconfigured. if they even still do this? dont really need duel map. if tuned right one tune will do cruise towing skids, with no compromise an old g1 lem link will run it no worries. v5 was the last of the lem links, the earlyer the version the less features they had. and map resolution was smaller g3 and g4 links are a big step up from the g1 stuff. they are software configurable to suit any engine also, so dont have to be sent back to link if its been setup on a different engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubastreet Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Megasquirt! Something with duel maps would be cool, one for cruise, one for towing/skids If EFI is set up right, you don't need dual maps. If you want to cruise, go easy on the pedal. Plant your foot and it'll squirt heaps of juice in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0R10N Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Link still do subboard replacement/upgrades on the G1s, although their stock of certain types is now running low. Sent two G1s back recently to be upgraded to V5 spec/changed to Mazda CAS subboard, no worries there. one was a V1 (the guys at Link were tripping out since the last time they'd seen one with that specific firmware was about 2006) and the other was a V3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikuni Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Link still do subboard replacement/upgrades on the G1s, although their stock of certain types is now running low.Sent two G1s back recently to be upgraded to V5 spec/changed to Mazda CAS subboard, no worries there. one was a V1 (the guys at Link were tripping out since the last time they'd seen one with that specific firmware was about 2006) and the other was a V3. The link forum offers more info on this. I've been watching what links have been going for, for a little while now and I don't believe its worth it. Unless you could get a cheap G3 onwards computer, I think you'd be better to go brand new. Atleast you have a fresh setup with manuals, loom and everything ready to go and you know it will work. As a point of interest Ed, how much does it cost to have the G1's reconfigured? I guess if its stupidly cheap it might make it worth while, but I still think that for a saving of only ~$500-800 it is a much better idea to go new as far as ecu's go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowlancer Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 I believe it's around the $200 mark? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UTERUS Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 I have a V14, i think it was $120/150. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0R10N Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 is moar expensives to upgrade anything older than V5. Three hundred and sixty three moolahs each, to be exact but for the price I picked up both Links for (one came free with a parts car, the other was $20) it was alright. V5 is ferpektly fine for running B6Ts, but I eventually want something with a bit more grunt to run the FJ20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EURON8 Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Food for thought here. also, how come noone has said anything negative about M series yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishtailfred Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Megasquirt!Something with duel maps would be cool, one for cruise, one for towing/skids If EFI is set up right, you don't need dual maps. If you want to cruise, go easy on the pedal. Plant your foot and it'll squirt heaps of juice in there. + 1 to both things. By definition, you tune each zone to be most efficient, where efficiency could mean power (high load) or fuel (mid/low loads). One map is sufficient. If you wanted to run two fuels in the car, say alcohol some time and 98 the rest, two maps would be handy. In terms of link vs ms it's something like this : early link < ms1extra < middle link (don't ask me which ones) < ms2extra < newest links The late model links are very sophisticated ECUs, BUT, do you need that much grunt? MS2 is a very capable device. A few people in this thread have ridden in my untuned ute recently and can testify to the fact that it idles dead smoothly on 550cc injectors and makes shitloads of power. In fact, making power is the easy part, it's all the other parts of driving that are hard for an ECU. I still recommend buying a v3.0 board and ms2 chip, mostly. If you don't plan to make much power, then you can definitely get away with ms1. That twin turbo silver supra is ms1, as is the twin turbo vk 1uzfe commodore em_knaps just knocked out of his garage, and his 2jz hilux (4x4 miss this weekend, yes!!), and his t25 turbo frog and a dozen other ms cars he's built and/or tuned. All ms1. MS2 is definitely better though. If you are gunna use big injectors, get it. If you aren't, balance it against ms1. Jean from jbperf, who is an awesome dude, just released an expander for ms2 so that one of the old gripes, not enough pins, is now more or less history. MegaSquirt has it's issues, and not *just* politically, but it's still good if you put the time and effort in. As for FreeEMS, although it has now run a vehicle (1500km across the USA) it still isn't ready for prime time. With a bit of luck I may swap the ute over to FreeEMS fueling in the next few weeks or months, but I wouldn't hold your breath for a full featured stable device just yet. By the end of the year looks reasonable at this stage. I should get an update on the status of the project out in the next couple of weeks. I hope the above helps. Fred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishtailfred Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Also, I'd like to add that MS3 has recently been released. DO NOT BUY IT. Let other people find out all the stuff that is wrong with both the hardware and software. ms1/ms2/v2.2/v3.0 stuff is all well tried and tested and thus, we know how to make them work. All the ms stuff has had learning curves/debugging on customers cars, don't get involved in that, stick with something that is known to be awesome. Fred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuel Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 would ms1 handle throttlebody injection with two large injectors? am thinking about going multi point later anyway with perhaps 510cc injectors. only aiming for 250hp or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishtailfred Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Yeah, it'll be fine, it's happy doing TBI because that's what it started life doing. The MS founders are very v8/tbi/os in their thinking and habits. The worst case is an overly rich idle, or in the extreme, an unstable idle. Early links have similarly low resolution. 1:1 cc of injector to cc of cylinder is about the break point, but you can run anything with anything if you are keen. I'm sure my truck would run OK as is on ms1 also, it'll just run better on ms2 and when I get it FreeEMSed it'll run better again Fred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuel Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 by the time you order the kit, get the stimulator + extras + cable etc a MS-II v3.0 or v3.57 is going to be about $600-700 anyway. will MS-I support an rpm switch output like VTEC/MIVEC (basically I want to control the 3rd valve solenoid)? also would a MS-II be able to do boost control? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0R10N Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 Thinking of running the DASH with one? see this link re: controlling the solenoid for the extra valve with MS1. hmm I'd imagine any early Link/MS1 would have a bit of trouble with my 850cc injectors at idle... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuel Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 yeah the DASH has one 860cc injector and one 1600cc injector as far as I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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