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Wideband oxygen sensor vs narroband. Innovate LC1's etc


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Looking at getting this Innovate LC-1 as bellow as a new oxgen sensor by itself is over $300, and this one on trademe incudes a INNOVATE DB Gauge + LC1 Lambda Cable + O2 Sensor. but i dont really get what it does etc :lol:

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motor ... 206625.htm

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/lc1.php

Im getting confused what does what. Iv established that i can run the above with my G1 V5 Link ECU but whats the differance between wideband and narrowband oxygen sensors? Do i really need it? or can i get away with just getting a narrow band single wire oxygen sender that goes dirrectly to my LINK. I like the idea of the single sounding wire allot simpler? but would i be missing out on some major advantages the Widband oxygen sensor provides?

http://www.trademe.co.nz/a.aspx?id=259614217

So far iv only worked out 3 wire is recomended as it's heated & that 3 wire is more stable.

Is that correct?, with the narrow band its simply one wire running to the ECU?

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wideband is real time full exchast anaylising but narrowband is only used to measure small samples quite slowly and i think they can't measure how rich you are past a point so only really used to lean it out under high speed crusing, ie motorway driving

i wouldn't run a link in closed loop mode with a wideband, heard nothing but bad things....

only use the wideband for tuning, which you won't be doing anyway, and LC1 is a waste of money for any real tuning, you need somethign that logs revs vs afr so you can then tune, or else you have to watch the gauge and tune as you go which is doable but not the greatest

and yea 3/4 wire is normally heated because it won't measure anything under 600 degrees or something (i can't remember) so its just applying power to the unit to self heat, easy as to do

so you could run a 1 wire narrowband $50 sensor to the link for leaning out on the motorway, but i rather just pay for the gas than risk it going faulty and then the computer going lean and engine going pop

thats how i understand it.... may not be quite right :rolleyes:

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From link

"Wide band gives you a 0-5v output.

Narrow band gives you 0.1-1.1v output.

This means you have a finer resolution using the wideband, but the advantages are more likely to help in the later ECUs.

Yes to keep it simple, just run the narrowband unless you need an AFR gauge on your dash.

The V5 was essentially pretty simple, so you don't need anything else I would imagine.

The cost of the 1 and 3 wire are $100.00 and $130.00 respectively. That is excl. GST."

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wideband is real time full exchast anaylising but narrowband is only used to measure small samples quite slowly and i think they can't measure how rich you are past a point so only really used to lean it out under high speed crusing, ie motorway driving

Close, a narrow band is just a standard zirconia lamda sensor which geneates its own voltage, the ouput of which is nonlinear and is most sensitive around stoichiometric. So basically its good at telling the a ecu when the engine is stioch or there abouts, not much use to tune the engine as the resolution is no use once running lean or rich.

A wideband sensor is the same zirconia sensor as above but with a gas pump over the head. The gas pump has a feedback loop which keeps the narrow band sensor reading stoich, and therefore the gas pump current directly indicates the oxygen content of the exhaust instead of the zirconia cell. This gives a quicker reference and doesnt cycle lean/rich like reading the narrowband output itself.

low'n'slow as said a wideband is only if you want to tune the thing your self. Most people with a link wont even bother with the narrow band, I wouldn't. Its only use is constant monitoring and leaning things up under cruise conditions. Factory cars have this to compenstate for all the different fuels/conditions that could be encountered by their mass produced cars. Your tuner, if he's decent will give it a decent lean cruise tune and you shouldnt need the narrowband. So dont buy one

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A cobber of mine is into his links, and has a handheld innovate wideband O2 meter. He uses it when he's tuning his full house batty. I've borrowed it on occasion (in fact still have atm, but he's said he wants it back real soon) and they are the shit for tuning your engine. I stuck it on my drawthrough supercharged A15 to see why it was hitting the wall at 6 grand. (spark or fuel) and as it went flat, the mixture went lean as hell.

Plus settting the idle mixture, iwas able to read the meter, and tune it to bang on stoich.

While driving, it jumps around a bit, but if you're into laptops and shit, you can do data logging. and with efi, tune around any holes in the fuel maps.

I might even help a mate with his only just running drawthrough turbo A12 before I have to return the meter.

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I have had a lc-1 with my megasquirt for just two days I love it. I used to borrow the local cert guys hand held display but that was abit hard with no rpm logging so I bought my own sensor and controller and log it all on my laptop which is choice as better fuel economy got rid of a few boggy spots where it was to rich and it makes 1.5psi more boost.

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yea man dont run any o2 senser, when it gets tuned they have their own wideband logging so no need. they can attach to rear of exhaust also so not really nessary to have a bung in the dump pipe.

sorry i havnt done your plates yet man, things at work have just been so tapd out with jobs out before xmas. will do them between xmas and new years.

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Proper computers all run oxy sensors, Without one your fuel economy suffers as does drivability. Doesn't matter if it's a race car, a street car is a POS without one.

Steve

alot of factory cars run lean/stoich cruise in closed loop using the oxy sensor for increase fuel economy - but alot of '80s and early '90s efi didn't and could still get good economy. you can get good economy with carbs which just work by having holes in them.

the car in question is a race car so it's not even relevant. it's simply not required. wideband for tuning, once tuned leave it be.

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Proper computers all run oxy sensors, Without one your fuel economy suffers as does drivability. Doesn't matter if it's a race car, a street car is a POS without one.

Steve

no, they are mostly there for emissions. keep the afr around stoich, less emissions and cat converter works better. you can get better economy running leaner than stoich (14.7 afr) well up into the 15's. plus theres less heat produced as well. the trees wont love you for it though

if a car drove bad with an aftermarket ecu and no o2 sensor. the tune was shit. thats it

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