mikuni Posted October 13, 2010 Share Posted October 13, 2010 The BEAMS appears to be more tunable, Glenns is making far more on the dyno than any NA F20C I have seen. I stand to be corrected, but a lot of the 'tuning' that people do on the F20C often takes the engine backwards from factory power output. Actually I'd be keen to see a decent build of an F20C, or even a K20A if anyone has anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanners Posted October 13, 2010 Author Share Posted October 13, 2010 Yes but the beams is already 33hp and 1250rpm behind, so even with my quads etc I will be lucky to match that power. I am more concerned with the complication really. Just little things like the returnless fuel system and the size of the engine mean that its a really big job for lil ol' never done a proper conversion me. My nickname Spanners came about as a bit of a mockery from wrecking my cars, not cos I am good with tools. In saying that though, I have some ratchet spanners which make me basically an F1 engineer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuel Posted October 13, 2010 Share Posted October 13, 2010 new sig time, thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Posted October 13, 2010 Share Posted October 13, 2010 Yeah I converted a front wheel drive (Well, MR2 one) beams engine to a RWD configuration for mine. As stupid as it sounds, its actually a hell of a lot easier that way for a conversion. The FWD beams motors dont have the returnless fuel line, just normal... Doesnt have eletronic throttle body and pedal position sensor and blah blah, just normal. Runs a normal idle speed controller, too, so can run quads with an airbox and airflow meter, wired in with a 20V TPS and run the standard idle speed controller on it too on standard ECU. Wiring it up is a bit more simple too. Altezza motors are a mish for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuel Posted October 13, 2010 Share Posted October 13, 2010 Are you able to use an Altezza head on a FWD Beams block to gain the Dual VVTi? or what about FWD ancillaries such as the inlet manifold, throttlebody etc on a complete Altezza engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 You could bolt it the head on, as in marku's thread the pistons are the same so you shouldn't mash valves, you wouldn't want to put a manual one on as fly cuts for valves may not match? The intake port is different on the tezza so I doubt you would want to put the FWD manifold on? it probably would just bolt to that little adapter they have pretty sweet though. But you can definitely lean over and FWD the Altezza motor if your keen But as Roman pointed out it is much easier to wire up a Redtop so it makes a good choice for a RWD conversion if you chuck a few Altezza spec bits on it (sump etc). If you go for the Altezza blacktop you have to be prepared to go after-market ECU or wire in the whole key and dash from the Altezza Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 The sump, exhaust manifold, intake manifold, etc can all swap from one engine to the other. I've heard that ports are bigger on the M/T Altezza engine, but I've got an intake manifold and gasket from one, and port matches almost exactly to the redtop engine. The benefits of the M/T Altezza engine are the gruntier cams and slightly larger valves, and higher compression ratio. (11.5:1 instead of 11:1) Titanium valves are a downside though, apparently a fair few cases of them mashing themselves and making engines go asplode. Think its on the TODA website that they reccomend reverting to steel valves for race use for them engines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyBreeze Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 ^ yep, have heard the same thing about titanium valves in race motors. Ti can't handle the same sort of abuse steel can so eventually they let go. Probably fine if you are going to replace them often i'd say though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 ^ yea sweet if your a big budget race team and replace them, then again there is a shit load of YZ250F's out there and it doesn't seem to be a massive issue, but Ive definitely heard of the failing. Ive read a few papers on race engine design and they tend to only use Ti valves and buckets when the cams or revs are high and the forces on the valve train become to great and cause failures. Lighter gear = less stress and better reliability. Theres a paper on MotoGP engine design to that outlines this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanners Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 Well I am never taking the head off if I dont have to. Ever. Engine will remain standard internally. I will probably only go up to 8000rpm anyway, and will try and be gentle sometimes. Not really. I think with 11.5:1 yamaha have already done the important bit. Then Toyota fucked it with a dual mass flywheel and an electronic controlled TB. Who know where to get ITB filters from? Any good brands other than Pipercross? What about 2 pairs of adidas ankle socks and some cable ties? I hear they are designed for maximum HP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Build a plenum, filter socks are a crime, dyno proven to rob power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanners Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 Not really much space for a plenum. You think a perspex one would be ok if I do make one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Make one out of modeling foam and take it to the fiberglass man, pay him a couple hundy and bam 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truenotch Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 If you wanted to go for an upside down FWD manifold w/single TB I can sort you out with some bits to moleste. Pipercross's are good but are expensive. You can more than likely make a good f/g airbox with a panel filter for the same money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celica RA45 Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 out of 5 race motors that i have 3 are altezza and 1 is a red top and 1 grey top all heads are rwd .its only when they are set up at the factory for which car etc are they then machined differently Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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