Christchurch City Council wants to BAN cruising

[callum49]

Christchurch City Council wants to BAN cruising:

http://www1.ccc.govt.nz/haveyoursay/ConsultationView.aspx?ConsultId=687

I do NOT like this law. You should make a submission. Here is the submission i made:

I and 21 of my friends do not support the Christchurch City Council Cruising Bylaw 2010. It should not be passed into law. This bylaw would be a serious restriction of civil liberties by restricting freedom of movement that the Bill of Rights gives all New Zealanders. As long as New Zealanders obey the laws of the land they should not be punished for just "cruising" in their vehicle. Having a bylaw that puts a time limit of less than 60 minutes on when a driver is not allowed to "cruise" through the same road is a danger to democracy.

If you look at the current laws, there are actually already laws to prevent some of the things that this bylaw wants to do. Here is a list of examples of existing laws to prevent 'boy racing' activities:

Racing a vehicle on a public street: The Land Transport Act enables the police to impound a vehicle for 28 days if the vehicle was used in an illegal street race.

Speeding: Police can fine drivers for speeding and drivers get demerit points.

Pouring oil on the road: The Police may serve the person with a $600 infringement notice. The person may either pay the $600, or choose to defend the charge in Court.

Impeding the flow of traffic: If a driver's speed, when driving, is such as to impede the normal and reasonable flow of traffic, that driver must, as soon as is reasonably practicable, move the vehicle as far as practicable to the left side of the roadway when this is necessary to allow following traffic to pass. If a driver does impede the flow of traffic the police can give the driver a fine.

A driver should be able to form a convoy with other vehicles as long as the drivers obey all the existing road rules. The road is for all drivers and limiting why a person can drive on the road is un-democratic, especially when the driver has a license and the vehicle has a warrant and rego and the driver is obeying all the other road rules. The "cruising" part of the bylaw would be similar to limiting why people can walk on a footpath so if people walking on a footpath in a group are laughing and having fun and taking up space on the footpath, that would be illegal. That is why banning "cruising" is un-democratic.

Drawing attention to the power or sound of the engine of the motor vehicle being driven should not be illegal as it does not go on for a long period of time because if a driver continuously revved their engine for hours it would damage the engine. Revving an engine is not like a stereo that you can just leave on full volume for hours and hours. Most people rev their engines to either test it or to show off, not to disturb anyone, so if this bylaw was introduced it would punish alot of innocent drivers. With music from a stereo playing at a person's house party, the stereo is allowed to be loud but there is a decibel (dB) limit so if the music is within the limit and the neighbours can hear it, the neighbours would have to put up with it. With a car engine there is no volume control so drivers cannot rev their engine to a certain volume limit so that is why banning revving of the engine is unfair because there cannot be a compromise.

So for these reasons this entire bylaw should not be passed into law.

[dirty_leppa]

i agree these bylaws are BS, but the council dont give a fuck. they see it as if they bring these rules in, it will cut down the numbers of people continuously driving around town etc, which in turn will keep the noise down, speeding down and racing to a mininum.

good on you for putting in a submission but i fear we are all out numbered by all the fed up residents who are tired of all the loud noise, boy racers etc.

lets hope it doesnt go through, but i think its too late.

[mk2escort]

My understanding of the bylaw is that you can drive around as long as you want as long as your not impeding trafic or driving in a way that draws atention to the sound or power of your car. Eg you can drive the aves all night long as long as your not being a dick by reving your car out or driving slow.

Opinions?

[RUNAMUCK]

It wont afffect me, I dont roll the aves. It's beyond me why anyone would want to do laps all night. (yes, I'm an old cunt)

All it would take would ba a smart person to draw up a route that took longer than 60 mins to drive which encompassed ALL off the the streets on the proposed ban streets list. Then they couldn't do anything about it.

Or someone to chalange it in court when they get rolled. Find a civil liberties group to foot the lehgal bill, and stick it to them.

[rob]

Callum: Good on you for making a submission, but having been party to earlier attempts to stop this stupid, ineffective law I'm going to recommend that you don't hold your breath

Runamuck: It's not just the Aves... all in all I believe there are about 60 roads in Christchurch that will be affected, including all 2-lane roads and the route out to Sumner.

Mk2escort: Cruising has been defined as "repeatedly driving over the same stetch of road in a manner likely to draw attention to your vehicle or it's engine". As I understand, "repeatedly" means "more than once", but wtf does the rest of it mean? Sounds ripe for selective enforcement.. Can you imagine trying to argue in court that your car wasn't "drawing attention" when there's a carload of cops who say that it was?

Bob "Cunt" Parker was talking about getting automatic numberplate recognition on the traffic cams to police this new bylaw.. So pretty soon the movements of the entire city will be monitored, logged and analysed for potential boyracer activities... Police state anyone?

I attended the select committee that was held to let people have their say on the Bill that made it possible for the City Council to pass this bylaw... It was plainly obvious the politicians had already made their decision, and no amount of reasoning or level-headed arguments were going to get them to change their minds.

At the select committee, EVERY submitter, both for and against the Bill, agreed that the biggest problem was noise, there was not a single person who wasn't in-favour of more restrictive exhaust noise requirements. The idea being if the noise is reduced, then the harm to the motelier's business/regular people's sleep is reduced. Despite this, the select committee didn't even recommend noise limits be looked at, they just went right ahead with the same broken, misguided ideas that they had BEFORE they "asked" the community for input.

I drove through town during the last 4's and Rotors weekend and was honestly surprised at how quiet the cars were.. Considering it has to be the biggest night of the year for cars driving around the city. I recently spent a week up in Auckland - the noise from the cars on the roads up there is far, far worse than anything in Christchurch. But I guess in a city that has at least 1 armed robbery per day, some dick with a farty car isn't really a top priority.

The Christchurch "boyracer problem" isn't about loud exhausts or dangerous driving - It's all about the city's image and the Fendalton/Merivale crowd's distaste for a hobby they consider to be crude and working class.

These pricks won't be happy until no one can have any fun in a car and that's why instead of getting laws/initiatives that will try and curtail the actions of the badly-behaved, law-breaking minority, we get laws that punish everyone - regardless of whether they are breaking the law or not.

[callum49]

thanks guys i'm glad other people don't like this bylaw. But Please make a submission too OR just copy and paste mine. Make your voices heard. It Could change the minds of councillors. It's better than wondering "what if" you just made a submission.

Post here once you've made your submission.

[Brock-Lee]

If it stops cunts with drainpipe exhausts driving past my house all hours of the night and keeping me awake then I will support it.

I laugh at how people get all twisted knicker spec over this proposed "police state", pull your heads out guys, people break the law on public roads continually and then complain when the police react. I hate these threads and the only reason I am posting is becasue Im bored as fuck.

All in all this was pointless

[rob]

Yeah the thing is driving your car isn't breaking the law... or at least it wasn't until they came up with this latest legislative turd.

You obviously haven't been paying attention if you think people complaining about this are the sorts who pull skids and try to drift around subdivisions at night. This is the Government and the City Council turning driving your car and resembling a stereotype into a crime.

Like I said, EVERYONE at the select committee was pro noise-limits, but the Politicians and the City Council ignored an idea that might have had a chance of reducing the negative impact on the community; instead opting for a shitty, un-enforcable law that wastes valuable police time. You ever wonder why the cops don't give a shit when your car gets flogged/broken into? It's cos they're too busy policing shitty populist laws like this one.

You're an idiot if you think this is a good idea, or that it will make any difference to the retards who rock fartcans at 3am.

Everytime some shit-ass politician needs a ratings boost, they bust out the tired old boyracer war drum and pass some more laws that reduce the rights of legitimate motorists.

I for one am fucking sick of my hobby being used by self-absorbed politician cunts to prop up their fucking egos and support bases.

[KKtrips]

typical kneejerk reactions - Chch and Hamilton are well publicised as being unruly boyracer towns - a large population base in a compact area with one central area compounds the issue (as opposed to Auckland and Wellington which has more centralised areas to spread out its problem)

So can you blame the local government for their reaction - by all appearances it is out of hand in those cities - I have visited and it is borderline rush hour gridlock in key areas after 9pm on Friday and Saturday nights..

However I agree and think it is a stupid suggestion to ban cruising by law but when you hear mosquitos buzzing around your room at night - do you just try and spray the one bastard that bit you or do you spray the whole lot and kill em all..

Moral of the story - It's easier to get rid of the whole problem than to single out the annoying ones..

[danger]

I vote we just ban Chch from NZ

[Rusty]

I vote we just ban Chch from NZ

make christchurch the next state of aussie and then aussie can leave the rest of us alone

[rob]

I vote we just ban Chch from NZ

I vote you stick to torturing your neighbours cats instead of dishing out useless viewpoints on topics you know nothing about.

Oh, and Rusty can go suck aids out of a hobo.

[Rusty]

rob must think hes the mob. whats your patch say Keyboard warriors christchurch or keyboard warriors Australia

[rob]

Nah I'm just a white boy who thinks you're a retard.

[rob]

Moral of the story - It's easier to get rid of the whole problem than to single out the annoying ones..

That may be, but you and I both know these new rules won't get rid of the whole problem

It's going to wind up alienating young people, load them up with fines that they cant pay and increase the tension between them and the police. Basically, it's just going to escalate the situation and cause more problems for everyone.

I just wish the City would take a more constructive approach to dealing with the issue. Back when I was in primary school, the Panic-du-Jour was Skateboarding. Apparently, back then, skateboarders were antisocial vandals who did graffiti and drugs and were generally not very nice people. The City was all set to ban them from footpaths and parks and basically do all they could to marginalise skaters... But then (for reasons unknown to me) the council started listening to some of the more perceptive councillors and decided to try building a place for skaters to go, rather than blanket-banning them from the city.

These days Christchurch has gotta have over 10 different skate parks, and it's been over a decade since I saw any scare-mongering negative press regarding them. Problem (essentially) solved.

The solution to the "boyracer problem" will come out of an attitude change, the part that most people are missing is that it's going to require an attitude adjustment ON BOTH SIDES before any progress can be made.

[KKtrips]

Do you seriously believe that the ones that create the antisocial problem are going to adjust their attitude? They will carry on believing that its "the man" out to get them.. And carry on doing what they do cos hey don't want "the man" telling them what to do..

There will always be to and fro-ing between youth culture and the authorities.. Generally the Authorities assert themselves by making a law and the Youth assert themselves by breaking said laws and sunsequently getting penalised for it.... hmmmm - who wins?

IMO - You would be better off trying to change the ones who cause the problem and mimimizing the reason for the authorities to react.. Rather than trying to change the reaction..

[mk2escort]

These days Christchurch has gotta have over 10 different skate parks, and it's been over a decade since I saw any scare-mongering negative press regarding them. Problem (essentially) solved.

I do think if there was a place for us "boy racers" to go where you could go watch skids and look at other people

cars ect a shit load less would be on the aves/ at the skids Why would you drive around wasting petrol (and geting fines in if this law is passed) when you could legaly go and do it off the street where there would be no cops or old people getting shitty at you. Why dosnt the govt just build a place and be done with it then there would be no excuses if you did get busted doin skids or cruising

[dirty_leppa]

mk2escort - have a look through here.

http://southerncarculture.org/

i know people are gonna say, that they are just doing what has tried before, but after speaking to some of the main people involved and looking at there plans, it looks like it could work. we just need some more opened minded people to join up and get involved to make it happen.

lets hope it can get off the ground as it sounds very promising

[rob]

Do you seriously believe that the ones that create the antisocial problem are going to adjust their attitude? They will carry on believing that its "the man" out to get them.. And carry on doing what they do cos hey don't want "the man" telling them what to do..

There will always be to and fro-ing between youth culture and the authorities.. Generally the Authorities assert themselves by making a law and the Youth assert themselves by breaking said laws and sunsequently getting penalised for it.... hmmmm - who wins?

IMO - You would be better off trying to change the ones who cause the problem and mimimizing the reason for the authorities to react.. Rather than trying to change the reaction..

I agree, you're never going to attain a state where everybody behaves perfectly ALL the time, if we could there'd be no need for the police, the justice system etc etc etc. Criminality isn't specific to people who drive cars - every subculture has it's troublemakers, but I don't see laws targeting rugby supporters/players, despite all the drunken violence and damage that is caused by them.

Christchurch's problem's aren't any better or worse than any other major NZ city, it's just the rich jerks who run the city have decided to use the city's car culture as a scapegoat for society's ills.

This new law sucks because it does nothing to prevent actual criminals committing actual crimes, it just creates a NEW class of criminal from young people who are (at the very worst) causing an annoyance.

[rob]

I also agree with you that this "young vs old" is a repeating pattern in society. All I'm saying is that now we've identified this fact, shouldn't we start looking for solutions to this problem that have the least damaging effect on everyone involved?

Targeting cocky young cunts and slapping them with outrageous fines and convictions for basically just being a noisy pest is not exactly going to endear them to society or fill their bellies full of good feelings for "the man".

Regardless of how you view the issue, the guys and girls out there driving their cars see it as just a bit of harmless fun with their mates - and if you step back and gain a little perspective on it, isn't that really what it is? Sure some people can't sleep and it's bad for people's business, that really sucks, but in the grand scheme of things there's a hell of a lot bigger problems facing NZ - if only we spent half the time agonising over them as we do some stupid kids with a buzzing car

Basically I see no gains to be made by actively criminalising and marginalising young people, no one wins if the next generation is a pack of police-hatin'-dont-give-a-fuk thugs. Kids don't gain a respect of the police when the police come down on them like a ton of bricks for some minor infraction, shit like that just makes people grow up hating the cops, and that's really not good for society.

Since we know kids can be headstrong jerks, shouldn't we act like the adults we like to pretend we are and take the higher road.. I'm not saying we shouldn't punish those who step out of line, but we definitely shouldn't start making new laws that turn otherwise law-abiding kids into criminals - just cos they're into cars!

(edited for speelung...)