Threeonthetree Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Glad to see your build thread finally appear! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakotom Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Um, what happened to the car phone???? Is it still in your car? If not, if you've still got it and want to part with it let me know Sweet wagon though! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Couldn't throw away such a good looking phone but be warned: I'm a short arse and I still banged my left leg on it, as it takes up a lot of space in the foot well. I'm sure we could do a swap for something of similar (low) value, if I can ever find where I buried it in the garage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threeonthetree Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 I was super busy over the weekend and could only use my phone to post a discussion thread. Hence my few words. Glad to see your trailer managed to do the job and that you got it all home in one piece. Excellent storage solution too! So when it comes to the conversion, KK (K-Trips) has pretty much done exactly what you're about to do. Follow his build thread here to get an idea of the work involved: //oldschool.co.nz/index.php?/topic/26289-k-trips-1982-holden-commodore-vh/ As for the parts you bought, I'm not exactly sure what the differential is out of but I'm pretty sure it's VN based on the width and housing. Here's a bit more information: http://www.aussiev8.com.au/driveline-suspension/33590-diff-information-thread-basics-salisbury-borgwarner-bw78-ford-9-a.html Keen to see what's going on inside that 308 too in terms of camshaft wear and bore sizing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KKtrips Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Make sure the diff is a wagon one. The shock mounts are different to a sedan. If you are running stock wheels then diff width wise it will be fine but if you are running a bit wider than stock then it will rub on the guards. Also if you run stock 14" wheels and want to run V8 brakes on the front then check they fit under your 14's. I have VP V8 front brakes (bolt onto stock struts) but they do not fit under stock VB/VC/VH 14" wheels. If you have any questions then I'm pretty confident I can help with most aspects - providing I can remember. haha. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threeonthetree Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 KK, did you change the K frame in your car when converting to a V8? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 K-trips, I must admit to having read your build thread a few times before I joined up here, so I'll re-read and actually try and absorb some relevant information though I must admit that although the words may go in, their meaning doesn't always follow; a bit like this: I'm adamant that the 14" wheels will stay, as to me they really make the car and I love the styling of the early Commodore steels mine wears, especially with trim rings. Kind of miniature late 60's Camaro wheels in my view and I do like a nicely styled steel wheel. I'm guessing V8 Commodores ran 14" wheels back in the day, so am hoping that something will fit inside them to provide acceptable stopping power. I think the idea will be to keep the diff I have and get discs attached to it, so hopefully the spare one will come in handy for parts. It was a bonus bit really that came with the motor so if it's not usable, there's no real loss and I'm sure someone else could make good use of it. When the time comes Neal, I'll try and get some relevant photos of cam wear etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KKtrips Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 KK, did you change the K frame in your car when converting to a V8? Nope - but I had to when going from 4 to 6. Not sure what modifications would have been made to for an LD28 though - it may not even be a 202/308 x-member in your car Jon. I believe that early Commys did run 14" rims on the V8's too but I'm not sure if the brakes were any different to 6 cylinder. I expect they will be hard to find in NZ if they are different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Mine was originally a 202 and 4 speed manual (should that make any difference at any point of the conversion), so no 4 cylinder shenanigans there, I should imagine, especially as the 4 cyl models didn't appear until the VC. When picking up the 'box I was told by on of the fellas at By'Gone that I'd need to swap from a 6 cyl clutch pedal to an 8, as for some reason it just didn't work without this when the box had been in the last Commodore it was used in. Sound plausible? Let's hope the brakes/wheels don't cause too many headaches. I'd just assumed that HQ-HZ stud patterns would have continued to Commodores for some reason but that doesn't seem to be the case. However, I'm guessing that V8 HQ-HZs ran 14" rims too, if that would help me any with finding suitable brakes to fit in my rims? Maybe it's the next lot of parts I should start looking for, in case they are a bugger to source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Right, I did some that's typical with me and Google'd the shit out of trying to solve a few questions, mainly about the K frame and the rear discs. In the process, I got myself mega confused or just didn't find what I was looking for rather than just getting outside and giving things a trial fit to put my mind at rest. Then I did a bit of that for good measure, too, so here's my findings. Apparently, K frames for I6 and V8 motors are one and the same, up until VKs. The only difference comes when wanting to go from armstrong steering to power steering, which was mandatory on all V8 models, apparently. Anyway, mine's non-power steering, so I was a little worried that I may have to get down the gym and work on my guns but then I remembered that I run an LD28 and I'm pretty certain they're heavier than the original 202 and not much lighter than a 308, so there probably won't be much difference. Then after pointlessly staring at a computer screen for answers to the brakes issue, I had the genius idea of actually trying a 14" rim on the diff I have, to see if it'd clear the discs. Here's my findings: Looks OK from the front...... .....and the back, too! Have a close-up, for good measure. Then I took another look to find out parts numbers for brakes and this page : http://www.bendix.co.nz/catalogue?manufacturer=Holden&model=Commodore Suggests that rear pads on disc brake VBs (i.e. V8 models) were the same as those on all later Commodores up to VT, where they changed. Not conclusive proof by any means but it gives me peace of mind that I'll be able to retain the 14" steels and that I'm not going to be using brakes that weren't designed to stop a VB with a V8 and also later, heavier Commodores. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threeonthetree Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 Yes, you're correct with that observation regarding the use of the same brakes pads on the rear of Commodores for the best part of two decades. But the problem may arise when it comes to the larger front brakes. Also it does this old fella's heart good to see you out mucking around with this Commodore and getting stuff done. Keep up the motivation! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakotom Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I'm not 100% on this, but... Front brake wise: There's a 270x22mm rotor which is standard on early Commodores through out. Which fit under a 14in wheel And then a 290x22mm rotor as found on VL turbo Commodores and VN V8 (also 6's that run fe2 suspension) after which run the finned callipers which require a 15 in wheel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KKtrips Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Tom and Neal are correct about the brake sizes under 14" and 15" wheels. I have the finned callipers under mine. HQ V8 brakes are completely different and dont even bother down that path. If you are resolute about running 14's then pesevere and find the correct v8 early Commodore brakes, even if you need to get them out of Aussie. I have non power steer in mine and the steering is not tooo bad. If I run the tyres at the recommended 38psi its light enough but I prefer 32psi so it is a little heavy in parking situations. I also run the 6 cylinder pedal and it works fine and is light enough to operate. I do have to run a few washers under the plastic adjuster at the bellhousing end but it works perfectly fine. I'll let you know in a few years time how it is once I've adjusted the clutch a few times and see if it runs out of adjustment. haha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threeonthetree Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 HQ V8 brakes are completely different and dont even bother down that path. Couldn't agree more with that. They're fine for H series Holdens due to the ease of fitment. But even the H series guys will move to Commodore brakes once they increase the performance a bit. I think that going for the Commodore brakes that Tom pointed out will be the best option. As for the K frame and power steer, I'll probably be in touch if one pops up for cheap enough, might be handy as a spare should you wish to convert to power steering later on down the track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Sourcing H series brakes was really a bit of a backup plan if it proved impossible to get V8 spec. Commodore brakes under my 14" rims - I figured that if they could stop a heavier car (which I guess an HQ is) then they'd be OK for a Commodore. Anyway, sounds if I've already solved the issue, if Tom's info is true, as I'm already running 270mm x 22m discs up front. That's not to say that I wouldn't be spending a bit of cash on getting things sorted in the braking department, as they're quite shit at the moment but I reckon that's probably the condition of the existing components than poor design. I think I was getting a bit hung up on the rears being an issue simply because that's where I'll be making the change, from drums to discs. Of course, applying a bit of logic and assuming that fronts are always bigger than rears, I should've worked out that there wouldn't be any clearance issues. But then that's a major failing of my scattergun attempts at problem solving when it comes to working on cars and doing research, etc. and why I'm so grateful to be virtually spoon fed all this useful info from this forum! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KKtrips Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Apparently, though I haven't tried it, fitting a booster and master from a VT Commo is a good improvement. They bolt on with only one brake line requiring a minor rebend by hand to fit. I shall be fitting one in this years off season I reckon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Sounds interesting. I doubt I'll have it all assembled any time before the winter, so may well keep an eye out and see what you think, if you go ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakotom Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 ^ VS commodore plastic booster bolts right up with minimal modifications where as VT needs custom bracket for firewall. Then you put a VT master (VT/Y/Z) onto VS booster (is a quickfill style master) which needs minimal mods (screw pulled out and shortened) and then Either get adaptors to run your lines into master due to different flaring or thread pitch (can't remember) or make new brake pipes. You remove a block off bung out of one port from the VT master to use it without ABS Link to step by step guide ---> http://www.calaisturbo.com.au/showthread.php?t=134762 It's what I'm doing to my VK along with the VZ front brake upgrade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakotom Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 Oh, and SUPPOSEDLY you can run the finned style calliper as found on VL turbos, VN v8/v6 with fe2 suspension and up to VS with your standard small rotors (which I think they fit under a 14in wheel) if you just use your calliper brackets. Difference is that to run the big rotor, the calliper mount bracket is spaced out longer to accept larger diameter rotors. Eg this type of calliper Which supposedly dissipates heat better than standard callipers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KKtrips Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 I have VN/VR finned V8 callipers and rotors. Not sure if they are any different to V6 callipers of the same era. They bolted straight onto my 4 cylinder struts and a 14"wheel would not fit on - not even close. Picture of my front brakes compared to the 4cyl originals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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