kpr
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Posts posted by kpr
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Yeah numbers are degrees, but but dont reference to anything other than the pulley position . 0 being fully retarded.
from memory you can change it, so it shows referenced to crank position. but it just makes it confusing to setup/tune-
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Yeah you can see the actual timing (yellow) misses the target (pink) by a little when you get back on the gas. but by the time your at full throttle its matching the target.
top one is your current "vvt" map. since race car and assuming you dont care about fuel economy, I'd run something more like the bottom. or a less aggressive ramp at least. so your always on target when get back on the gas. Not really much of an issue in your case but thought would explain it better.
Ive compared mine, which essentially mimics at 1j/2j setup vs @Roman daves 1nz setup and seems to react pretty similar. yours seems a little faster. either a honda thing or the control is a little better in g4x-
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I was going to comment about probably changing the cam timing map. so it doesn't go to zero cam advance when throttle is closed. due to the mechanical time it takes the cam to re advance when get back on the throttle.
but looked in the log and looks like it keeps real well. nice one mr honda. so isn't really that much of an issue. possibly a little more crisp on the throttle if changed it.As for what cam timing it needs. will need to be done per engine. unless 100% stock to 100% stock. as changes to the intake and exhaust will change what cam timing it likes.
The shape of the cam timing map looks right. starts to retard at high rpm etcThis as part of the log @Hyperblade posted. cam stuff at the bottom
The vvti control works real well even on my old g4 link.
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So I went to put this thing back together. but I had stolen the 3-4" silicone hose for the intake for the 20v.
Said silicone hose connected to the airbox i made from the stock 2L airbox
This thing loses 5kw vs just the filter by itself. likely due to the lack of area around the filter. plus the inlet in the side even though its 3"
Ive never made a better one because lack of space. plus would be a diddle to make something such and odd shape.
When done the intercooler i freed up a little more space and moved the ps reso to the other side. So thought i should at least attempt itstraight away made my own life hard using the same big 4" inlet filter. made a 3 - 4" cone that had to be cut into the lid of box on an angle.
yeah it probably would have been easier to make the top bolt onto the box rather than the end. but cant make things too easy
cutout on the bottom to clear intercooler pipe
4" inlet. needed to make inlet big as possible to cover up my sins of using a 90 silicone bend off the side. i had first made a ali bend/ cone to go in the side, but couldn't
get the box in/out of the truck.
I only added a little rubber mount at the front, to hold it in place off the body.
It just hangs off the silicone joiners at the other end. Wasn't sold there would be enough flex in the silicone joiner between turbo
and airbox, if solid mounted airbox to body . since the body is rubber mounted to the chassis, it can move around a bit. First thing to
eat shit would be the turbo.
next, to see if it actually works
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There is a excel 4 link calculator floating around which is good. Its pretty hard to get a textbook setup. will likely end up with a compromise somewhere. but so is most factory stuff. I would suggest having a few extra holes either side of what the calculator spits out, at least one end of your links, where room is available.
From what i can tell the "instant center" is just a dumbed down way of getting you in the ballpark, that comes from all the other numbers being about right.
there is lots to it, some of it doesn't matter too much depending what your trying to achieve, other stuff does.-
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They will rev cut if throttle is closed and revs go over x amount. if not running the water lines to throttle body, will idle higher when warms up. as uses the water temp to slow idle. might get away with adjusting idle screw or throttle stop. otherwise vac leak somewhere
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I tried the outboard injection again . probably easiest to watch the video than me trying to explain it. but the gist of it, seems like theirs a tiny bit in it cooling or mixture wise. maybe 1-2kw but it seems like to me, that it moves the tuned intake length around a bit. shorter runner acts more like a longer one. It did make 167kw though. which i think is the new record
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sorry just seen this. the cam pulley sizes are the same between 16v and 20v engines. 36 tooth. is the bigger round tooth pitch. i forget the numbers now. I couldn't find much that matched to pitch and tooth count when was hunting for pulleys awhile back. most were 40 tooth. or the smaller pitch
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I get asked punishing requests every day.
just happened to read this before going to fill up at gasser. absolute zero effort to tune any thing for economy. and its borderline tuned properly for cruise atm. but put this here for reference next time is on dyno as i'll forget the numbers.
yeah it pulls 4000rpm at 100k. so never going to be prius spec haha.
its like a cyclone out, and road wasn't completely flat so somewhere. ran it both ways. probably 8.5% throttle is 100k on dead flat. vvti 40 degrees. so have 40 to go full prius/retard.the dyno hp readout doesn't have enough resolution to do cruise stuff. but using the torque numbers and running in a lower gear to mulitply the torque, for more resolution works well.
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Nothing too exotic in the engine itself, other than the vvti setup of course. All off the shelf parts in the bottom end. Head mostly the same. but is a bit of money in getting the bigger valves in there. new seats and stuff. Once start adding all the supporting stuff on guess is going to be pretty spendy. dont really want to add it up haha. If counted the time Ive spent on it, that would be by far the biggest cost
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tried shortening the intake 30mm as the vvti turd seemed to like it. This thing said no. red is normal intake length rest are 30mm shorter with various vvti settings. nothing would pull the dip out and didnt make anymore peak
tried air filter on/ off zero change in power
Shut the bonnet, = 2kw more. same thing the turd engine did.
Along with doing a few more tweaks to the vvti map and tune. managed to fill the dip before 8k. compared to last time:
curve looks super nice for something with 300deg cams
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so managed to get a little more advance out of it. another 5kw on the bottom end. power curve looking pretty sweet now.
Rpm scale slightly off on this one. forgot change it when adding the stockish engine run (pink)
Vs the 318/304 hvc cams, filled in the holes nicely. should drive heaps better. really nothing in it top end wise. Its even better than it looks on paper, since runs way nicer with the vvti and smaller cams
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Managed to get it to start ok without putting a limiter in pulley. had to crack the throttles open quite a bit to let more air in. and messed with tune and cold start settings alot
Only makes 70psi on compression tester when cranking. usually well over 250psi. can feel it blowing air back the throttles on compression stroke! so ive basically done the opposite of @Roman and turned my 4age into a prius engine. It actually idles best at full retard. like it has some weak little cams.
The vvti is pretty slow it react. but 99% sure its just the oil feed line. i had to come off the oil pressure sensor hole. just used an an4 line had hanging around. will change to an6 see if fixes.
Going to try get a little more advance out of it, piston to valve already pretty tight but, i'll gamble bending some valves for a little more, as it still gaining midrange with pulley maxed out. will also help with the prius engine issue.Good news is, its making good power on smaller cams. vvti setup is using 304/300 cams. Below is vs the 318/304 was running at os drags
ignore the bump at end.. dyno being a diddle
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VVTi version 3.0 up and running, on good engine. this time using stock pulley sizes
Got issues with way too much travel on the 304deg cam though. its setup so max advance is just before piston to valve contact. Which isn't far off where i normally run this cam fixed. max retard is whatever the pulley travel is back the other way
max retard is the pulley in "relaxed" position, so its at max retard when cranking. the ecu is reporting 69degrees travel, which is lots. since the cam is so big, it means the intake valves are open waaay into the compression stroke.
No drama once engine is running, as can advance the cam. getting it running is the problem, its like trying start an engine with about 3:1 compression.
I'll try a few more things in the tune. But best solution is going to be limiting to the pulley travel. 30-40degrees will be plenty enough, and should hopefully start a whole lot easier.Early days, but otherwise every thing seems good. no leaks and advances and retards like it should.
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depends what your trying to do. ok if you just want a bit more power. but turbos have come a long way in the last 20-30 years.. get some newer tech on there, same spool more power and/ or easier on engine at same power
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Managed a new pb yesterday, at least in na spec anyway 13.25 @ 105mph
done a bunch of 13.6's. started at 3800rpm launch. kept putting it up as was bogging off the line. much different than with the 195/45 r14's, which would basically have to drive it off the line, but since the gearing was so low would pick up rpm fast enough to get an ok 60ft. with the 185/55r15's china tyres was super lazy, but surprising amount of grip. once got launch up to 5000rpm , 60ft started to drop. done a 13.4. next and last run put it up to 5500rpm. spun a little, went 13.25. with still pretty rubbish 2.10 60ft.
13.1 probably would have been doable with few more runs, but pretty happy with 13.2 . Should easily do a 12 with better tyres. but little clutch and t50 would be in a world of hurt.
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Ah yes, that was the part i wasn't sure on. out of link manual, should have scrolled down further. kinda makes more sense, kinda doesn't
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little street pull/ sound check at start of this vid:
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maybe plausible its avoiding fuel going out the exhaust. orange is rough injection window at 9500rpm. around 4ms. some guesstimation and poor math says would take almost 1ms more to get to intake valve. but that doesn't take into account the intake valve would be shut at the time. and making it out the exhaust valve for that matter
It did have a bad day when running at 300 but mostly through the low/midrange. lost all the power. possibly didn't like the fuel hanging around in the intake port, rather than going out exhaust. who knows, maybe majority of the fuel is going through on the overlap and mixes better. Interesting there is something in it though. have tried in the past with smaller cams and didn't do shit so left it locked to 400.
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If my drawing is correct. this is pretty close to whats happening in my engine.
end of injection being when the ecu closes the injectors. start is calculated by ecu depending on fuel requirements. so the more fuel needed, the start moves to left. also more fuel required i'm moving the window to the right. so is it loosing fuel out the exhuast on overlap? or some other wizardry? as can see there is a pretty big opportunity when both the valves are open at 5mm, for air fuel to go which ever way it pleases haha. I haven't done the math, but would assume start of injection would be well before the overlap. but then there is also the time it takes to make it from the injector to the exhaust valve before it shuts.
injectors are 980cc running at 40% duty right up top. approx 100mm back from intake valve
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So going back a few pages, I found what looks to be the dyno graph, just before last time took it to the drags
so yeah should do stuff, maybe
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Done a few more tweaks and got a touch more out of it.
fixed some stuff in the fuel system that was causing a few afr spikes.
played with the injector timing, which seemed to give some small gains here and there, mostly noticeable right up top 9500+ Pretty much lined up with when afr richest = best.
I had been running fixed 400 end of injection which worked pretty good for fixed number. heading towards 300 would result in massive loss in bottom end. but it did like a little less than 400 down there.
right up top it liked over 400.
So yeah running this engine with the big 980cc injectors is actually a benefit. Seems to be a touch of power in it. Even if there wasn't/isn't, would be wasting fuel, going to a smaller injector. since the injector would be open for so long, part of it wouldn't be burntBottom line is what it likes at wide open, ignore the rest of map haven't fill it out properly yet.
Injector timing made some of the changes in fuel map slightly less aggressive, but yeah big cam itb tune always going to be all over the shop
contrary to popular belief, something like this is harder to tune than a turbo engine making way more power.
gains from last time in red
the atlantic engine in dark green. I should probably try the big headers at some stage. think it will be really close to the atlantic curve. at least lose the power below 6k haha
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Hyperblade's KP61 Racecar "KP61R" Discussion
in Project Discussion
Posted
Oh and the intake plenum size. probably aren't loosing any power there, unless your loosing some effect from the intake tube. bigger plenum damping out the pressure waves, unsure how much of a thing that is. There will be a little bit in getting the intake tube the right length and size. but wouldn't expect big numbers from it.