Roman

The c56 1nz bellhousing is 1nz specific, so theres no direct bolt on for a t50 

The sump on these are a lot more complicated, because the cut line is up around the centerline of the crank, rather than having the block extend down past everything. 

So you'd definitely be modding one, rather than remaking one. 

But another thing is, with the motor being so small you could possibly just have the whole thing sitting up above crossmember anyway and would be sweet. 

It's hilarious to see how short that motor looks when sitting on top of that crossmember, haha.

Yeah, just the difference from iron block to alloy I guess! 
This engine would be way lighter and more compact if it was designed from the start to be 2.5 litre. 
But, part of the reason it's good for this application is because its bodged down to 2500cc from a bigger design.

It's also amazing how much you can win or lose based on accessories as well. 
Like some of the engine brackets on factory engines are absolutely massive cast iron things!

Hahaha its all good fun aye! 
I think part of the issue was just the way the article presented it. 
By which I mean, when I posted the trackday video first somewhere, it gets a really positive reception. 
Then people ask what's in it, and cant believe it. 
But then if you tell it by the numbers first, no one wants to watch a trackday video that validates the fact that it did indeed go quite good. 
Then another issue was that the article sort of made it sound like it was making 150hp at the engine. 
Which on an American or UK dyno means about 30whp. 

I've already got one ball busting project thats proving difficult, I didnt need two. haha! 
If I was doing a K swap or 2ZZ swap, this car probably wouldnt even be going yet. 
But I learned so much from it during that short time span, it was awesome.

13 hours ago, anglia4 said:

This thread still occupies so much space in my brain. I find myself constantly adding Echo's and Vitz'z to my trademe watchlist...

One thing that has definitely changed, is vitz peoples perceptions of C56 boxes. 

It used to be that if I didnt go grab one out of the car from pickapart, it would stay in there and be crushed with the car. 

The most recent manual vitz RS to land at pickapart, was not even off the forks and someone was there to grab the box. haha.

Although, not so many coming through these days, think I was right on the tail end of the bulk of NCP13s lifecycle through pickapart. 

12 hours ago, 440bbm said:

So what actually happened to this, all i've seen was all the shenanigans here and then it went BOOM and has it just dissapeared or just got parked for now somewhere for more funds/rainy days/carina finished?

I parted it out, and no one wanted the shell so it got towed away by the wrecker. 

Done and dusted! 

Carina will be cool though 

maybe 

Hey I was talking to an Imp guy, and mentioned that you'd added some weight in the back with the reflectors. 

He said no worries, just pop an extra brick in the front and you'll be right. 

Hope that helps 

Shit yeah! Thats awesome to be WOF'd. 

Are there any enrichment settings in ECU you can play with? 

Might need a tad more on throttle stab

I guess an intetesting datapoint is that if you look at almost any motor that transitions from cable to ethrottle. They end up with bigger throttle(s)

As you can just reshape the opening rate to get around drivability issues at low rpm. Where 30% throttle might give you 90% of airflow.

More displacement will just turn your drivetrain into a noodle by loading it up with low rpm torque.

Maybe a little bigger cam, bit more boost will acheive same thing easier?

There's so many headaches associated with engine machining work, that can often go wrong even if you get the best people involved. 

I reckon there's bound to be a sweet spot for you with factoryish block and the right bolt on stuff. 

Do you have any guesstimates for drag day time / MPH / etc? 

I think I'll be somewhere in the 14s on first shakedown and with standard cams. (assuming I make it)

 

Matching the pedal and throttle body doesnt matter, as they both communicate to the ECU completely separately. 

So find a pedal that best fits rather than what matches the motor. 

Some good options for e-throttle pedals from commonish cars. 

Prius/Aqua/etc has a pedal that's easy to get. RX8 pedal is a nice unit if it fits. 

The prius/350z/etc sensor is like a TPS with a little lever arm on it, so you might be able to weld something up to just adapt this to your factory pedal. 

A lot of the expensive looking aftermarket options that do the same thing as you're suggesting (Jenvey, EFI hardware etc) 
Look to just be a Bosch ethrottle unit with the guts put into a CNC'd housing. 
I think the chopped up factory throttle body is a good plan, might need to retain something to support the far end of the throttle shaft though.

This is only 2 wire which would suggest it's just a regular DC motor but not sure how it would work in reality. 
Says 24 volt so not sure if it would work okay on a 12 system, guess so?
Might work too slowly though, dunno.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006106982472.html


EDIT: 

This one might be good, good price too.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005007988405812.html

The bulldozer throttle setup wasnt suitable, I also bought a cheap cruise control cable unit.

However I found that it housed a stepper motor not a DC motor, so too much of a pain to get it working.
Would have been a nice solution if it was a regular DC motor.

E-throttle is just an H bridge controlling a DC motor...
So you can literally use any DC motor that is within its torque and rpm range with the available juice (~14v and 2 amps or something like that?) 

A lot of the ethrottle setups have a lot of internal gearing to step down the motor speed by roughly 10:1 - 20:1 kinda range. 

I'd definitely not reccomend removing any of the springs from the throttle bodies though, probably wont pass wof/cert/etc, and it's also very dangerous if your motor fails and there's nothing to bring them to home position.
 

It's quite common to see a step between the head and the flange, as there's no downside to it being slightly oversized. 
Acts to reduce reversion a bit. 
But unlikely to be worth the effort of the extra welding etc steps halfway down the pipes for a manufacturer.

 

I cant find a beams motor comparison @Truenotch, you able to snap a pic of intake port for comparison? 
As it's a really interesting before/after of a VVT motor.
Early 3SGTE port was wide to accomodate TVIS then absolutely pinched up like crazy. 
Disgusting. haha.

5 hours ago, 440bbm said:

then you had the ability and development of alloy heads, casting possibilites and how to manufacture these repeatable. How much easier casting methodologies and more intricate shapes..  It's not just down to carbs or not.  It was the time, where else can they save the money from in the cost of the car to the increase the cost of development and engine costs. there is so much more at play here. 

Its a never ending loop. the more you think about of cause/effect and the times back then the deeper the hole gets. 

Ahhh yeah I agree 100% ! 
The things that need to be taken into consideration at an OEM level are insane. And all of the constraints applied, and then trying to make it a sellable product with a warranty that lasts 100s of thousands of kilometers.
We're lucky as DIY tinkerers to have the freedom to do whatever the hell we want.

I guess the point I was trying to make, is that "old info" on the internet has a loooooonnnnggggggg lifespan.
And that generalizations about port size and so on, are only relevant metrics compared to other similar engines. 
The graphs that @BiTurbo228 posted are really interesting because they show what a huge variation there is on what some people might consider to be a hard and fast rule.

For example, some testing that David Vizard might have done in the 70s or 80s, about optimizing a 2 valve carb motor.
Studied port sizes, ratios, runner lengths, and so on.
This information is absolutely 100% valid, in that context. 
So for example, for that motor having good air speed is absolutely critical. Or you're getting fuel puddling in the engine.

But then on some EFI engines some dyno testing shows that runner diameter just isnt a critical factor anymore.
Going too big has virtually no downsides, and going too small absolutely kills it. (or whatever) 
Yet some people will spend $$$$$ on an EFI motor and choke the hell out of it with tiny throttles or whatever.
Because they've applied irrelevant generalizations to their particular engine.

I've seen enough formulas, theories, etc absolutely fall on their face when it comes to emperical testing.
That apart from following some very loose rules about how things should be (no super sharp edges on inlet runners) I think it all just comes down to testing testing testing.
Some people pick a formula, decide that's the best possible thing, then test it and just accept the results good or bad. Rather than testing more iterations to validate their concepts.
So thats why I'm itching to get to that point, this current part sucks and I apologize to everyone who's been reading my drivel this long without seeing any interesting results for better or worse yet.
Hopefully though I'm close to the finish start line