Hyperblade Posted May 7, 2020 Author Share Posted May 7, 2020 So old engine is now out of the car, so time to work out what it weighed. 144.91 kg - 3SGE Beams Gen 5 with lightweight flywheel (6kg), Exedy HD clutch, sq engineer Alternator bracket, echo/yaris alternator, sq engineering slim line water housing, water lines at back of head chopped, top cover chopped, altezza engine mounts, no oil, no intake, no exhaust. 38 kg - J160 with cross member, gear lever + knob, slave cylinder, no oil 9.48 kg - Stainless 4-2-1 Headers went back just past firewall 7 kg - Blacktop throttles, SQ Engineering Adapter plate, Toda 75mm trumpets, Standard Altezza rubber spacer, and standard Altezza engine to rubber spacer plate, steel bracket for quad vacuum manifold, vacuum manifold and idle up valve and piper cross filter and fibreglass backing plate. So in Total: 161.39 kg Engine + Intake + headers 182.91 kg Engine + gearbox 189.91 kg Engine + Intake + gearbox 199.39 kg Engine + Intake + headers + gearbox I honestly wasn't expecting it to be that high. 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted May 9, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted May 9, 2020 So now for the Honda K20a Weights. 105 kg - K20a Euro R, no oil, no balance shafts, ktuned alternator bracket and water block off, D15 alternator, stock oil cooler removed, MRP oil cooler sandwich plate, no intake, no exhaust, no flywheel, no clutch and lots of bolts left in the block, no engine mounts. 34.8 kg - S2000 AP1 Gearbox, no oil, no slave cylinder, no gear stick. 11.69 kg - Stock 4 - 1 Headers with Heat shield. 5.72 kg - Skunk 2 Ultra Street Intake mainifold with 74mm Skunk2 Throttle body, stock injectors and stock fuel rail. Misc Info: 4.85 kg - Stock water pump housing with thermostat 5 kg - Stock Balance shafts and oil pump. 1.1 kg -Electric Davies Craig Water Pump 0.47 kg - Hybrid Racing Pod Filter 1.39 kg - K2F Adapter Plate 5.87 kg - K2F Flywheel 1.27 kg - Exedy S2000 Clutch Plate 4.64 kg - Exedy S2000 Pressure Plate. Alternator Weights: K20a - 5.68kg B18 - 4.64kg D15 - 4.9kg So if we compare like for like with the BEAMS 119.27 kg = Engine with clutch, no engine mounts. 34.8 kg = Gearbox 6.19 kg = Intake 11.69 = Stock Headers Honda K20a with S2000 Gearbox Weights: 137.15 kg Engine + Intake + headers 154.07 kg Engine + gearbox 160.26 kg Engine + Intake + gearbox 171.95 kg Engine + Intake + headers + gearbox Toyota 3SGE BEAMS with J160 Gearbox Weights: 161.39 kg Engine + Intake + headers 182.91 kg Engine + gearbox 189.91 kg Engine + Intake + gearbox 199.39 kg Engine + Intake + headers + gearbox Difference: -24.24 kg Engine + Intake + headers -28.84 kg Engine + gearbox -29.65 kg Engine + Intake + gearbox -27.44 kg Engine + Intake + headers + gearbox 12 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted May 27, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted May 27, 2020 It begins... 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyperblade Posted June 1, 2020 Author Share Posted June 1, 2020 Up above I mentioned the stock water pump housing was 4.8kgs It's also a huge chunk of metal, and has a idler pulley down low in an awkward place. You can find AC/PS eliminator kits like this one. http://k-tuned.3dcartstores.com/Universal-AC-PS-Eliminator-Kit_p_248.html The issue is it puts the alternator even lower and I'm going to have a cross member there. So looking at the options I decided to go with a water plate kit This allows me to get rid of a lot of weight, run a lighter alternator, and keep it all away from the cross member. I chose the older k-tuned kit which doesn't support the K series alternator, only because it was slightly cheaper. I chose to only get the plate and the alternator bracket and pully. (not the water pump) as when I contacted K-Tuned they commented they had only used it in drag applications, and hadn't tested it in a road race application. http://k-tuned.3dcartstores.com/Water-Plate-w-Alternator-Brackets_p_600.html So why use an older alternator? Alternator Weights: K20a - 5.68kg B18 - 4.64kg D15 - 4.9kg Cause they are slightly lighter! Now ideally I would have gone with a B18 alternator but the shaft on it was too small for the pulley. So D15 it was, however it wasn't a straight fit, I had to clearance the top of the alternator slightly to fit. But the other advantage was the plug is the same as the K20 alternator. Sticks out a fair way, would have been nice to have it closer, but can't have everything. Chose a Davies Craig EWP 115 (alloy 8140) https://daviescraig.com.au/product/ewp115-alloy-12v-115lpm30gpm-remote-electric-water-pump-8140/ewp115-alloy-electric-water-pump-12v-8140 Australian made and with the Aussie dollar pretty good to NZ and shipping prices makes sense to go localish. Only annoying thing is they don't have mounting points, they can just be held up by the hosing, however will have to see how that looks when I go to mount it. Otherwise you can buy this bracket: https://daviescraig.com.au/product/ewp-mounting-bracket-kit-ewp115-130-150-8700/ewp-mounting-bracket-kit-ewp115-130-150-8700 The pump can be PWM controlled, so i will do this via the LinkECU through a PWM relay, so it will be pulsed on an off to control the flow depending on the temperature. So with this change I've cleared up some space, dropped 5kg and freed up some HP from the engine. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyperblade Posted June 2, 2020 Author Share Posted June 2, 2020 Next challenge was the intake manifold. With the engine rotated around into RWD config the throttle body points directly at the firewall. This is where you have so many options off the shelf as it's all been done before. You can buy an adapter plate to fit an F20c (S2000) intake manifold to the K motors, but they look terrible so I didn't want to go down that track. You could go Quad Throttle Bodies (with multiple options from different manufacturers, swoon...) Straight: Curved: Kinsler mega dollar ones... But this conversion is already going to cost a fair bit, so that can be an option for a later day... So I ended up with the Skunk 2 Ultra Street Intake Manifold https://skunk2.com/induction/intake-manifolds/ultra-street-intake-manifolds/307-05-0600.html It has a rotatable plenum cover, which can be removed if you want to go crazy and port the runners and you can also buy spacers for it to increase the chamber size. Supposedly it also gives 20hp over stock manifolds. It also matches up perfectly to a 74mm throttle body (standard for the engine is 65mm) so I didn't need to port anything and it saved a lot of time. The downside is the quality of the casting is not super great with some imperfections and I had to port match the thermal gasket to the head, which was disappointing as it should just be cut correctly from factory. The other thing to note is the Idle Air Control Valve (IACV)on a Euro R is NOT the same as other K20'a Type R engines, i.e it won't bolt up, so I got an Integra R which fits.. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted June 2, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 2, 2020 Right, now we are up to speed on where I am at. Now for the fun stuff. First strip the engine bay. Second turn the cross member around and bolt back on, so we get more room behind it, this also moves the front suspension forward so less angle on the bottom arms (as i was running quite a bit of castor), so benefits all round. We will swap the suspension over from left to right to suit, and then the questions is how to do the steering rack. At this stage I have a lead on what must be the only LHD starlet rack in NZ, so that is plan A, plan B is to use a LHD escort rack which is the same length so bump steer etc is kept consistent with current rack. Both require making new mounds for them. The engine is sitting behind the cross member, so no need to make any modifications to the sump which makes life easier! Obviously a heck of a lot of metal cut out to fit... Engine is deliberately offset to the left hand side of the car to help with clearance on exhaust port 4 and for weight distribution. #1 spark plug is inline with center of strut towers. #4 spark plug is under cowling, so we are going to make a panel removable to get at it. Clearance to the pedals/pedal box was the biggest worry, but we have ended up being no closer then the BEAMS motor. Exhaust ports 1-3 are all in free air, only the 4th is tight, we moved the engine forward from this position 20mm and up righted it a little bit to get more space. Heaps of clearance on intake side. And strut bar even fits across, Fab work going in, corner by pedal box has been rounded off to give event more space, bit area next to intake to give lots of options. Bell housing on gearbox is fairly large and also want to be able to remove it from engine in place. Goes back a long way. Bit rough under the car, passenger side will be cut out and redone to give more room for muffler. Engine mounted to cross member, can see how far back it's sitting. Boxing it all up, the big hole is for access to back of engine from inside the cabin, will have ali sheet covering it, nothing worse then trying to fix a water leak in an awkward location. Pedal box also gets an access panel to the top of it as it's impossible to access now. Steel used where the bolts go to the pedal box uses thicker gauge and rolled top edge for extra strength in handling the pedal forces when braking. Been told I could fit a TV in there, I was thinking some glass so i could admire the engine. Tubbing the front to support 10" wide rims so later on I can use the new TRS slick tyres. That's just the front... The rear is going to get a few changes too 24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted June 4, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 4, 2020 Brent is working away at a great pace. Here's a good shot of how far over the engine is to the left. Struts swapped left to right, bottom arms modified and tied back to the chassis, instead of the stock starlet swaybar which goes forward. Driveshaft tunnel tided up. We are going to have to move the gear lever 190mm forward to get it into the right position (more info on that later). Beginnings of rear changes, 3 link going in. The whole axle is being moved back 50mm and tubs going in the rear, so quite a bit more cutting to go... 16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted June 6, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 6, 2020 Gear lever in position. Gear lever Moved 190mm forward on gearbox, mount was cut off and the selector shaft shortened then mount welded back on. Means no need for loose linkage system to move the lever forward which should keep the nice gear change feel the box is known for. Can see it's quite a long way forward compared to original position. Nice lightweight panel to cover access hole. Engine sitting back in with front tubs done. Heaps of room around intake to have fun later on. Rear tubs in, the coil over mounts have been raised as well as I was running out of adjustment on the shocks. They have come up awesome, so tidy, Brent is doing an amazing job. 22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted June 10, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 10, 2020 3 Link done. Required driveshaft length has turned out to be 898mm so any plans for a 2 piece are out the window as there's not enough space for it, it would be just all fittings. On the flip side does mean less weight slightly and no need to mount a center bearing. 20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted June 13, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 13, 2020 Passenger floor was a bit gnarly so that's been redone, Now have space to mount he muffler higher, will take the exhaust out through the sill as I was occasionally collecting it on kerbs. New Radiator and oil cooler mounts. Oil coolers are a pain to fit, the fittings always stick out so much and there never seems to be a good place for them. We have lowered it here so I can get a 3.5" intake pipe hover the top of it so I will run the pod filter somewhere in the front. Have to go in front of the radiator as there is not enough space for the fittings inside the chassis rails. A whole lot of sheet metal to fab up to duct it through the bonnet again. When turning the cross member around the steering rack needs to be changed to suit. Plan A was an Escort LHD rack as they are same length as Starlet (bump steer etc) but would have meant new arms. Somehow I found the only LHD Starlet rack in NZ and it happened to be in the south island. New mounts for it then everything bolted straight back up, that's a massive time/$$ saver. Need access to the rear coil pack as you can't remove it with the scuttle panel there. Cutting a panel is a tricky thing as it's easy to make it stand out like a sore thumb. So I came up with the idea to hinge the rear of this section, and use the existing slots, and the fixing will be under the bonnet. So once cleaned up should be pretty subtle. One of the worries when doing the Watts link was that their would be no space for my current fuel cell. Luckily however it fits in really nicely. I was previously running the main fuel pump in the fuel cell, but I had to keep the tank at least 1/3rd full to stop surge, and I can't be arsed with that anymore. So I needed a surge tank, however I hate having all the external pumps and pipe work that most people do, just seems nuts to me, more points of failure, noise etc. So I went with a FITech HyperFuel G-Surge Tank from Jegs. https://www.jegs.com/i/FITech-Fuel-Injection/546/40007/10002/-1 I will be running a return system so will be simple arrangement of just connecting the hoses via AN6 fittings. I have a lift pump which will go in the fuel cell so again keeping everything internal. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted June 16, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 16, 2020 New Exhaust out through the sill to get it clear of the ground as I kept knocking it. Fuel/surge tank boxed in for a cover. Most of the bits back on. Wheel base has gone from 1300mm to 1400mm (standard AE86) so will be interesting to feel the difference. Fab work should be finished this week. 23 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted July 27, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted July 27, 2020 ***Warning lots of images follow*** Final fab work was to add a harness bar in, new Motorsport regs mean I have to run a HANS and the old mounting was technically 5 degrees to low. I took the opportunity to also rear mount the seat which adds a lot of stregth in an accident. also took the opportunity to add some gusseting in to the A pillars. Here's a nice clear shot of the modifications to the gearbox to move the shifter forward: Next up was the headers/exhaust, carefully designed to meet the power requirements by John at JPWPerformance (Honda header guru). 4-2-1 packaged nice and low in the car. I then had everything cermaic coated to help reduce the heat, decided to do the muffler and flexi as well to have a consistent look and protection, really happy with how it came up. While the engine was still in I mocked up the wiring loom after putting myself through an HPA Wiring course to get up to speed on some gaps. Then the entire car had everything removed for the big strip and repaint of the interior, underside and engine bay, as I wanted to get away from the black which looks grubby very quickly. Going to be a rattle can job as it is a race car after all. Engine bay first: Stripped: Etch Primed: First light coat of grey: So while doing all that I found a rust spot, and started digging... That then highlighted a bodge someone had done, and the rust had spread abit... Least i found it now when it's easier to fix. Stripped the interior: Etch Priming (hard with a cage in the way): First light coats of grey: Still need to seam seal so avoiding those places for now. So current tasks are seam sealing, then get the car on a spit so i can clean up the underside and I can get the rust fixed. New driveshaft is coming together, flanges have been manchined. driveshaft is 900mm odd long and actually has less then 1mm change in length when moving from top of suspension to bottom, but we have allowed for 15mm movement. 19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted August 18, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted August 18, 2020 Interior/Engine bay finished off: New Driveshaft done. so tiny!: I was lucky enough to be able to borrow a spit which made doing the underside possible. But what a mess it ended up making stripping the paint/underseal. Before: After: Really happy so far, looks a lot tidier. 21 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted September 16, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted September 16, 2020 So rust all repaired and on to fitting everything back together, a much more fun job. Rear diff painted, and new brake lines run. With the diff moved back, brake line won't reach chassis, so moved it to exit internally (all lines will be running inside the car) New feed and return lines run through to cabin from surge tank, using hardlines for as much as possible due to cost/weight savings. Tapped the head for the water fitting and blanked it off as I don't need it for my setup, saved 120g by chopping it in half... 18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted October 20, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 20, 2020 Picture heavy post follows: On to the finishing off the brake lines. Redone the pedal box piping so I can add some brake pressure sensors at a later stage, a lot easier to do it now then once it's installed. However it's a hell of a job fitting everything in, without the access port from the engine bay it would be impossible to get it as clean as I did. All lines are being run in the cabin to keep a nice clean look. Lines in wheel wells given some protection. Move the reservoirs which were remote to being directly on the master cylinders, saved 500g worth of hoses/fittings by doing so. Finally have a reason to add some honda performance parts... Fuel lines finished up, just waiting on a length of hardline for inside the cabin. Waiting on fittings to arrive before I can secure the pipes. TracTuff Timing Chain Baffle plate added to stop oil going up into the timing chain. Still waiting on my other baffle to be available. Engine back in the hole (will come out again) so I can work out positioning of clutch bulkhead fitting and wiring fittings. Added some Radlok fittings for the alternator and starter wires, really cool connectors, can rotate 360 degrees while attached. Mounted the EWP to the engine, very tight all around. 12 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted November 15, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted November 15, 2020 Been a bit quiet lately on this, I've been doing a fair bit of work on planning the wiring design and then I had to order the bits. The design was fairly complicated because of all the sensors I added, and planning the bulkhead connectors. I ended up with 2 bulkhead connectors due to the size of wiring I needed to get through the firewall, with one handling most of the engine, and the other handling high power items like Fan and EWP. Bulkhead connectors mounted with a nice plate that locks them so they can't rotate. I put myself through the High Performance Academy wiring course to tidy up some of my skills and learn the right way to do things, well worth it and @ProZac was a great presenter.https://www.hpacademy.com/courses/learn-motorsport-wiring/ My aim was to have a lightweight robust harness but that didn't use all the super expensive autosport connectors. And also no concentric twisting as that just adds more weight with filler wires. So Tefzel wiring and SE28(DR25 Copy) Heatshrink all round. I'm really happy with how the first harness turned out. The 2nd one is a bit more complicated (only half the wires)... Unfortunately I found out the Deutsch pin removal tools I got with my crimping kit shouldn't be used with the HD30 connectors as it fucks the locking tabs (bends them down to far). The tools I used were these metal ones. Where as the official ones are plastic. Of course I only found out after putting in the last pins which didn't want to stay put. I had an attempt at pulling the HD30 connector apart, and can confidently now say that you shouldn't attempt it as it's not designed to to be disassembled, I ended up braking the outer housing removing the inner pieces. But it did give me a good look at how they are designed, you would have to be very skilled to be able to fix the locking tabs in place, would need a magnifying glass and long very thin pick. 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted January 11, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2021 Exhaust in place for a trial fit, nice and compact. Engine side of the wiring loom done, except for the aftermarket sensors. Working on radiator/oil cooler ducting. Really happy with how they are coming out. Things are tight: So the Skunk2 Ultra Street Manifold, Skunk2 Throttle Body and the Skunk2 Ultras street manifold spaces (to increase plemnum volume) don't fit together. So you end up hacking the throttle wheel to make it all fit. Speaking of Skunk2 brillance, here's how the intake manifold arrives to you straight from the casting. Bit of hand work done to remove the casting flaws they left in it, not something you expect to have to do for the price... Intake is location is challenging so the front grill is now one piece so I could get rid the some of the brackets. Fibreglass bonnet to save some weight and to do the new exit ducting out of it. Ecu mounted out of the way: Nothing worse then trying to work on wiring in a car with a cage, so made the relay/fuse box able to swing out 26 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted May 30, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted May 30, 2021 So I've been slowly chipping away at everything, with life getting in the way at times. Finally managed to get the extra baffle i needed for the sump, it's a Clockwise Motion FD2 baffle, meant to be one of the best and should be handle the gforces on the slicks i run. Of course even though the FD2 engine was initially based on the CL7 one, Honda decided to change the sump ever so slightly between versions, so had to modify the baffle to fit. Engine back out to fit it, clutch and flywheel all installed and rear main seal done while it was out as it saves possibly doing it later. Gearbox has new bearings throughout as the original ones at 140,000 k's had had a hard life. Engine and gearbox back together and all back in and shifter finally fitted. New fuel rail arrived, and could finally fit the FIC 775cc injectors (smallest with datasheet i could get for the cheapest price) and FPR to the mainfold and fitit all for the final time. Next was cooling, so I got some ali pipes bent up to a template I made, keeps it really nice and simple (and light) and the only joins are at the engine, radiator and water pump. The standard breather is on what is now the back of the engine, which is pointing at the firewall and would just be pain to route to. Also when racing best to have a good breather system so 2 10AN female fittings were added to a valve cover i stripped and then painted. Next up was the cabin wiring, a pretty significant job, and the final piece of the puzzle was the console. Actually quite challenging to make as it needs to be within reach when i'm strapped in and also handle the main cutoff switch which takes up a lot of room. And to get it looking half decent takes some planning. So first step mocking up position of switches to make sure I can reach them. I want to be able to easily maintain and diagnoses any issues with the wiring, so I then made a grame for everything to attach to. Worked out where to put the cutoff switch. Then wired it all up. I'm running some nice Deutch connectors at the rear so I can easily unplug them and check what the pins are doing with a multimeter. Final version all painted up But finally all fitted up Heres the engine bay at the moment Exhaust has been fitted for final time and I'm getting down to sorting out the last of the stuff in the engine bay (ducting, intake piping, catchcan etc) 38 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted September 12, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted September 12, 2021 So managed to get it going finally after a bit of faffing around, Honda decided to helpfully change the crank sensor from EP3/DC5 K20a's to the CL7 K20a, that took a while to work out. First successful start. Starting it highlighted a weakness in the breather baffling I had done which meant oil was being pushed out. Here's Honda's original design: Here's version 1: New Version 2: Very tight fit and designed to force the air back on itself. Work has been done on the ducting into and out of the radiator and oil cooler. Radiator Exit: The oil cooler exit was a lot trickier, I needed space for the intake pipe, withour comprimising the ducting site. Pretty happy with how that's come out. Bonnet exits, still to be tided up. Big thing outstanding is the air intake, so been mocking up options. In the end I will go up with a straight simpler solution, plasitc pipe will be replaced with ali for smoothness. However I want to make sure it's got a cold air feed/box, so a bit of fabrication is going to be required around getting cold air from the head light. Here's a walk around of the whole car at the moment. 17 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hyperblade Posted October 1, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 1, 2021 Last bits of major fabrication done (front swaybar, driveshaft hoop) and finally had it on the scales for corner weighting. Before on left, current on right: All fluids and 30+ liters of fuel on board. Little bit off my goal, but shows how hard it is to take weight out of something. Could probably get another 15kg by going to fiberglass hatch and doors, but that's just $$$ I don't need to spend at the moment. Very happy that 35kg has come straight off the front! 13 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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