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Romans 2005 Toyota Echo - Back to 1300cc setup


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Yeah they are a separate shock and spring, I believe they are rebuildable shocks. 

Some people have fitted just regular coilover springs in the back of echo/vitz and it seats well enough both ends. 

So I might try find one at the right height with a stiff rate. 

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6 hours ago, Roman said:

Ahh not really necessary for an NA motor. 

I've been watching one of the videos of the launch, and I can see my rear suspension is punishing me a bit. 
The rear shocks are completely flogged, if I push the car down it bounces about 3 times before coming still.
So it's squatting heaps and unloading the front. 
So maybe some 60ft improvements with some stiffer / solid rear 


Got a picture of your time slip for the best run?

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2 hours ago, Roman said:

Type it out for you though. In brackets next to it, is my PB from last time 

MPH:   99.51       (99.65)

was there any reason you can think of the trap speed being basically the same? I'd thought it would be much higher 

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10 hours ago, Roman said:

Yeah but I cant even take a photo of it, because the printing on it is super shit

Type it out for you though. In brackets next to it, is my PB from last time 

R/T:    .531          (.411) 
60:      2.096       (2.182) 
330':   5.689       (blank)
1/8:      8.682      (8.928) 
MPH:   81.12        (80.17)
1000':  11.276     (11.583)
1/4:      13.496    (13.832)
MPH:   99.51       (99.65)

I thought my 60ft was heaps better being "2.0" but 2.096 is pretty damn close to a 2.1 haha

Only 0.086 seconds better! 

So maybe it is/was actually a power improvement, or the smaller tyre diameter helping out rather than an epic launch.

It looks like most of the gains were actually in the 1/8th mile region 



Definitely room for improvement in that 60ft. I dont know anything about making fwd hook up. 

But I've run slower than that, with a slower trap speed but a quicker 60ft. (Same displacement engine, with a huge parasitic loss at the crank) 

Itll be hugely interesting how a decent exhaust effects your trap speed too. They say the mph is the telling for how much hp you have, and the ET says more about your chassis. (Maybe it was you who said that?)

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It's interesting to see the difference it makes, being less of a weiner with launch rpm. 

On my fastest run, launched at 7500 and then rpm dropped to about 6300 at minimum. (pink line) 

The last time I was launching at 4500ish, and engine speed dropped to 2300 haha. 
This probably wasnt my fastest last run, but yeah really need to keep that rpm up and allow for that it's going to bog a bit.
These tyres are more happy to just keep spinning for a bit than bogging. 


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I liked how consistent your revs sounded at change, interesting to see it confirmed on the graph.

Any way to get the revs to drop quicker for another 1/10 on the gear changes? (Bikes use ignition kill changers, because sequential boxes. Koenigsegg use some kind of clutch to dump crank speed and match gears). May a sacrificial air con clutch to chassis for 30-80ms at clutch on?

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Yeah if I add a clutch switch then i can setup flat shifting. So ignition cut and no foot off the gas either.  just an ignition cut to kill torque momentarily.

Some of the guys there were saying this is beneficial on an itb setup to keep the airspeed up by keeping throttles open. But is that actually a real thing, or do they just have a shitty tune at part throttle/transient? 

Surely airspeed resumes almost instantly when youre at high rpm.

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Try a cigar? 


could you set it up so your launch rpm limit is switched off the clutch? So clutch in =7k clutch out= 9.5k for example

(I assume you have already got some sort of launch rpm limit)


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I might have mentioned this before, One thing people tend to overlook when it comes to shifting gears is clutch mass. You are probably aware of what a synchro is doing, it has to slow the clutch plate to the correct rpm for the next gear on the upchange, or speed it up on a downchange.. 

But if you can reduce the clutch plate mass by a certain percentage, or make the gear ratios closer together your synchro has less work to do and will facilitate a quicker gear change.. 

I haven't read right through the thread, but is the last gear change near the finish a necessity? 


In saying that it does looks like it shifts pretty well, with a well set up clutch you'd probably oy need to come back to maybe 50% throttle for the gearshift.. 

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This has a 4kg flywheel so its not bad. 

Yeah at full rpm full steam, this shifts quite well, I think the rpm drops quite quick so the synchros dont get too much of a hard time. 

At low load/rpm driving though this gearbox is absolutely chooched haha. 

Will replace the synchros one day.

Flat shift just helps minimize the variables involved in upshifting I guess.

And yes, unfortunately I do need that last shift over the line.... Hmmm maybe I could have strung it out for another 100rpm or so though and held it in third though. 

Still getting used to that shift light setup, my LED bars stopped working for some reason and I couldnt find the spares.
Having the LED bars that approach the center was incredible for getting shift times accurate. 
Much better than the light. So I'll set that back up.

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Synchro doesn't have to deal with the flywheel, or pressure plate, just the mass of the clutch disc, and input shaft etc.. 


So basically if you have a 6 Puck clutch, just cut 3 off with a hacksaw to improve high rpm shifting.. 

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