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12 minutes ago, johnny.race said:

Cheers bro, this is what I have always thought. And ta for the pics. An eyeopener for sure. I bet those fuckers don't grow on tree's anymore.

 

All good bro, shit like this keeps everyone on their toes.. I would've trundled on through life telling everyone that xe/xf shit is bolt on to a 9".. You should see the price of a genuine xagt/landau diff now, almost what I paid for a whole car.. 

 

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11 minutes ago, Valiant said:

Rolled splines only for you Bart,

@johnny.race I'll take a pic of my Val rear end if I get a chance in the weekend.

Post spline cutting the axle will be hardened, then annealed back to the  hardness at which it will enjoy peak tensile strength. 

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4 minutes ago, johnny.race said:

Its not a very good pic but you'll get the idea. Its a home made one. Is supposed to mount 4 index-able tips but only does 3 now, lol! Cuts 90 degree included angle. Is the fucking business.

 

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I actually meant of the actual cutter tip itself.

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oh fuck - sorry. Its a little square Kyocera one .... i don't have the number on me but can get it if you need. Its a bolt through one. About 1 cm square and probably around 5 or 6mm thick. I go through the expensive little fuckers but ..... they are wayyyyy cheaper to use than HSS and all the blunt hassles that come with its use. I am not a machinist ... no formal training or anything. Self taught. Asked heaps of q's to the right peeps. Passion and perseverance will match formal training IMHO. 

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Yeah a number would be nice please. Also I was curious about the shape of it. I'm not a machinist's arsehole.  But the old man has been doing it for overy fifty years. Hes shortening some BW axles for his Val diff. He reckoned that the tool his mate loaned him had a very sharp point. Where as (so he told me) the bottom of the spline wasnt such a sharp point. The diff shop guy said that's what people use. And he loaned him a brand new taper cone (never been used) as a test piece. 

Talking to people who have done it before can make save a lot of hassle. 

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By the way, here's a better pic.. i think what got me with the rears is the fronts are all interchangeable from xa through to xf..

 

DSCF3763.JPG

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13 hours ago, johnny.race said:

@flyingbrick Did you make your own luck bro? How come there are more holes showing in that caliper bracket when its mounted on your diff than when they were laying on the carpet? Did that center hole have to be made larger also? I have no small bearing ends here to check so had to check the BW against specs stated by aftermarket. It might be doable but its certainly not bolt on. Just saying from what I can glean from what i have and what I read. The bolt holes are near spot on but the bearing on the small Ford is larger than the BW and then there is the brake offset thingy. ( I actually measured and guessimated that a 13mm wide spacer might make it all work but then its only a theoretical guess) Would like you to clarify things for me so I am clear on matters. I still reckon its an urban myth for the most part but need (lol! - Need) to know the details. Its a passion of sorts.

Steelie Gears sell the spacer you are talking about (or they did - but Rat will tell you to go EA brakes nowadays)....and yes, these brakes will direct bolt to a small bearing 9" with the spacer.....word is, if the handbrake mechanism is seized on the calipers, be ready for a fight....

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I wonder if that spacer you talk of featured 9 holes and a register? Because if it didn't (and don't get me wrong - I respect the hell out of Mr Rattrie) it would make for an inferior fit up compared to what BW came out with in OEM form.  An adapter plate would more accurately describe it. But after having a good look at things and understanding what is involved - I would not be a fan full stop for removing any material from an already light looking aluminum caliper bracket.  I would be interested to see how stuff like that actually goes through cert.Sorry @flyingbrick nothing personal, just saying what I reckon about things. 

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15 hours ago, RUNAMUCK said:

Yeah a number would be nice please ...P3151613.JPG.06076dbc1a03cde10e956910b2303e49.JPG

Can use 304 instead of 308, I've used both and there is no real difference I could see. Here is the thing about all of this stuff ... hardened toyo Iron does not respect any cutting tool, hehe. They are all rounded off the same after the first couple of splines.

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Its sounds like Dad is going to have a go at it with a single point cutter? Tell Dad that he needs to cut splines that are 90 degree's (included) and that this will give that to him ie. 45 degree's on each side of the vertical = 45 + 45 = 90. You cunts know all this.  Tell him not to sweat it re the cutter having a sharp point as long as its a 90 degree include one. It can't be too sharp if you know what I mean. 

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This is a shortened 28 spline BW78 axle modded to fit a narrowed 9 inch. Behind it is a momento from an absolute beast!

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15 hours ago, johnny.race said:

I wonder if that spacer you talk of featured 9 holes and a register? Because if it didn't (and don't get me wrong - I respect the hell out of Mr Rattrie) it would make for an inferior fit up compared to what BW came out with in OEM form.  An adapter plate would more accurately describe it. But after having a good look at things and understanding what is involved - I would not be a fan full stop for removing any material from an already light looking aluminum caliper bracket.  I would be interested to see how stuff like that actually goes through cert.Sorry @flyingbrick nothing personal, just saying what I reckon about things. 

Hey man.

I feel like you may be reading between the lines a little to suit yourself.

I cant find the bits (i have shit boxed all over my home and hanging all over the shed) but the spacers are just that, spacers. They have 4 holes in each plate. They are part of the factory drum braked 9" axle assembly. If i get a splurt of enthusiasm later i may go digging (i had them gold nickel plated because it looks nice) .

If you think those holes and this brake swap cause reason to fail cert then BITCH YOU CRAZY*

Made a quick video. 

 

*Lets be honest, ill probably drag this out so long it never makes it to cert anyway

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This has been done to death. Cheers to the clip. I knew you'd been in there with your fly cutter bro, hehe. I'd love to see a pic of those spacers when you can, @flyingbrick Its not an aftermarket retainer is it? The reason I said 9 holes and a register was so that whatever factory design engineering went into the BW - it could be replicated on the Ford. 

I measured an earlier bracket than yours (but same application) and it came in a 7.5mm thick. Yours looks thicker than this. Hmmmm.  Anyway, ta for your post. 

 

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On 15/03/2019 at 22:08, johnny.race said:

Can use 304 instead of 308, I've used both and there is no real difference I could see. Here is the thing about all of this stuff ... hardened toyo Iron does not respect any cutting tool, hehe. They are all rounded off the same after the first couple of splines.

P3151614.JPG.e508e9f9785323c6f35f4f72f3c2f66a.JPG

Its sounds like Dad is going to have a go at it with a single point cutter? Tell Dad that he needs to cut splines that are 90 degree's (included) and that this will give that to him ie. 45 degree's on each side of the vertical = 45 + 45 = 90. You cunts know all this.  Tell him not to sweat it re the cutter having a sharp point as long as its a 90 degree include one. It can't be too sharp if you know what I mean. 

P3151611.JPG.a300a25bdbacb4be89ccbcfb0c2b0268.JPG

This is a shortened 28 spline BW78 axle modded to fit a narrowed 9 inch. Behind it is a momento from an absolute beast!

Not actually sure what he's got. He borowed a cutter of one of his mates. 

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He shortened some nissan r200 axles for a datto once too.  He did a few sets. Even showed the apprentice where he worked how to do them. Then got the verifyer to sign off the unit standard - on a foreigner/non work job!  Lol.

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This came in from out of a bro's car. There is a lesson here for those attempting to skimp in an area than rarely takes prisoners when it decides its had enuff of you. The only way his bacon was saved was through adherence to a scheduled maintenance/regime. This was picked up then. He was using these (wayy) outside of their intended design application as can be seen by the various other bits and pieces that came in with it. Yup, a Cut to Fit 8 and 3/4 MoPar with aftermarket bearing. Check out the drive studs in the flange. When they get this big they are not wheel studs anymore. When they are this size, they fill all of the hole in a mag wheel hole and use hardened washers and nuts to secure the rim. The studs are about the only serious parts of the entire assembly :)) Lol!

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I've cut a few of these over the years. It doesn't matter what brand they are, they (for the most part) all cut the same. I feel there is a difference between carrying out machine work on cut to fit axles compared to doing the same thing to OEM factory stuff. Some of these cut to fit ones have not much better than silver cheese in the middle of them. I don't think anyone guarantee's them for off road use. I dunno what this one was like in the center as he only brought it in to show me and for me to assist him with measuring up for the new ones.

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He originally wanted me to cut and untwist ... nahhh!! He stumped up for some through hardened ones and didn't fuck around.

 

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So you're saying the OEM axles ate made from more betterer material? 

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I'd assume OEM axles are only hardened where needed and if you go and cut them shorter you will be in an area with different properties (ie the outside 5mm might be hardened on OEM, and maybe not hardened where the shaft increases in diameter). When you go and cut it short and remove 5 mm from the diameter you would need to re harden and temper them to get the right properties.

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8 minutes ago, ajg193 said:

I'd assume OEM axles are only hardened where needed and if you go and cut them shorter you will be in an area with different properties (ie the outside 5mm might be hardened on OEM, and maybe not hardened where the shaft increases in diameter). When you go and cut it short and remove 5 mm from the diameter you would need to re harden and temper them to get the right properties.

I've been to that place you talk about. It is my experience you'd wanting to be revising your figure from say 5mm down to somewhere between 1 - 1.5mm max though if you want to retain any semblance of factory engineered strength about things. It is further my experience that heat treating  any OEM axle and expecting a win is snake oil. Just my thoughts bro. 

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The shiny outer is the depth of case hardening, the dull stuff - not so much.

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30 Spline. Yeah, they are big. They are bigger than a 28 spline 9" or BW is, and probably close to the same diameter as an OEM 31 Spline Bronco 9" one might be? Being short makes them look a fat too. but they are reasonable sized axles even in OEM form.

I am in the diff business bro, they only bring their diff shit here - not their cars. The first problem with Cut to Fit (ctf) axles is the fact they have 30 little stress risers and 30 little troughs where the material has been removed - running down and away from the business end. 

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