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Any Jap import Starion owners here? Question about rear seatbelts


0R10N

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Any Starion owners here happen to have a Japanese import model?

If so, how have your rear seatbelts been fitted - are you aware of any factory anchor points in the boot/rear C-pillar area?

Reason I ask is that the NZ-new ones obviously have three point retractable shoulder belts that anchor somewhere behind the seats, but Jap ones only have two point lap belts from factory and therefore any examples already here would have been changed to three point once they arrived in the '90s. I'm interested in finding out whether these had anchor points made, or if they have the same anchor points as the NZ models... and if so, whether these would still be suitable for compliance today.

Cheers!

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I pulled the boot panel off mine and had a look, they are bolted in to a panel on top of the wheel arch, I'm guessing that's the same as the NZ new one? looks pretty factory to me.

598ae8881484a_20170809_224237(Medium).jpg.67c3b465c09a423d4490f6308a456605.jpg

I found a  pic of a previous JDM Starion I stripped a few years back and you can see the same mount point there also, if you look really hard on the left hand side of this picture:598aea7c1c9cd_DSCF0962(Medium).JPG.0d8f23dac72d6cf2cf122fe016fdb663.JPG

hope that helps...

 

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Thanks @Firebrand, that helps greatly!

1 hour ago, locost_bryan said:

Were export and JDM Starions made in the same factory? If so, I'd expect them all to have the mounts installed.

You'd think so, but there are apparently a few oddball rules around retrofitting rear seatbelts.

Proving the factory points are there is only the first step, next is to convince the compliance people that they are suitable for mounting a modern seatbelt. Otherwise new anchor points have to be scratch built, which requires a LVV cert and around $4k worth of fabrication.

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Have never looked into those rules.  Was thinking of fitting inertia-reel belts into my Marina, which has mounts front and rear for static 3-point belts.  Won't be happening if I can't use those existing mounts, just keep it "original" as it's still perfectly legal to drive with just the static front belts.

Presume you need to get proof from Mitsubishi that the original mounts met the original and current NZ Standards?

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34 minutes ago, locost_bryan said:

Have never looked into those rules.  Was thinking of fitting inertia-reel belts into my Marina, which has mounts front and rear for static 3-point belts.  Won't be happening if I can't use those existing mounts, just keep it "original" as it's still perfectly legal to drive with just the static front belts.

Presume you need to get proof from Mitsubishi that the original mounts met the original and current NZ Standards?

For a WOF, you can probably just do it with no issues (I have a couple of cars with webbing grabber inertia belts that only had statics originally).

Entry certification is a tougher test though, and they probably focus on seatbelt mounting issues.

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11 minutes ago, Nominal said:

For a WOF, you can probably just do it with no issues (I have a couple of cars with webbing grabber inertia belts that only had statics originally).

Entry certification is a tougher test though, and they probably focus on seatbelt mounting issues.

Hopefully that means I'll be OK when I re-register the Marina back on it's dead original black plates.  SWMBO is not keen on riding in it with the static belts, still deciding whether that's a god or bad thing. lol

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3 hours ago, 0R10N said:

Thanks @Firebrand, that helps greatly!

You'd think so, but there are apparently a few oddball rules around retrofitting rear seatbelts.

Proving the factory points are there is only the first step, next is to convince the compliance people that they are suitable for mounting a modern seatbelt. Otherwise new anchor points have to be scratch built, which requires a LVV cert and around $4k worth of fabrication.

I guess if you know they are the same as the NZ new ones, you could just take your current Starion down to a compliance centre and see what they think...although different certifiers might have different  opinions...

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Is there any way you could fit the NZ-new type seat belts to the car before it goes in for the VIN process? How will they know that it only had the lap belts to begin with?

My '80 Eterna has the fixed non-retracting belts but my old '82 Galant GT had the retracting belts in the C pillar. The two NZDM Sapporos I wrecked had the retracting belts too so I grabbed them along with the C pillar trim to eventually swap in. I pulled the original trim off my Eterna and found the C pillar anchor points are definitely there for the retracting belts, despite having the fixed belts mounted to the rear parcel tray.

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Should be possible, say if I had access to the car in between its arrival in NZ and its departure for compliance @fuel. A guy on the Starion FB page offered me some maroon 3-point rear belts so the option is there.

My compliance guy has already seen the photo of the back seat with the lap belts, haha. But I'm sure he wouldn't mind. They only seem to get upset if you fix things like rust/damage before they get a chance to inspect it.

3 hours ago, Firebrand said:

I guess if you know they are the same as the NZ new ones, you could just take your current Starion down to a compliance centre and see what they think...although different certifiers might have different  opinions...

Yeah I was just thinking that. Could be worth a shot.

They might be able to spin me a sharn about the queer door-mounted front seatbelts as well, hahaha.

Been trying to get my head around all the techno-babble in this link: https://vehicleinspection.nzta.govt.nz/virms/entry-certification/i-and-c/vehicle-interior/seatbelts-and-seatbelt-anchorages

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On ‎10‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 10:06, locost_bryan said:

Hopefully that means I'll be OK when I re-register the Marina back on it's dead original black plates.  SWMBO is not keen on riding in it with the static belts, still deciding whether that's a god or bad thing. lol

Leave the lap belts in until re licenced then fit modern ones.

 

On ‎9‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 18:14, 0R10N said:

 

If so, how have your rear seatbelts been fitted - are you aware of any factory anchor points in the boot/rear C-pillar area?

 

 

My Jap version has a modified floor for 4ws rear end and its rear seatbelts were screwed (self tappers) through floor and bolted through plastic/light metal speaker housings.

I took it through VINZ for WOF's and it passed so asked their advice upon discovering this crude kiwi job, registered now as two seater. I don't see why if its a real expensive pain you can't remove the rear seat. I  assume factory mounts would be there but also recall the scary seatbelt mounting jobs done on early imports so maybe they aren't,

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13 minutes ago, Ranter said:

I was assuming not even Bryan would import a Marina (no offense Bryan) added to the fact he used to term re-registering I figured the advice was legit, a cert would be required if fitted before inspection.

 

Whoops, I didn't read well and thought you were referring to the Starion.

 

Continue as you were.

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9 minutes ago, Ranter said:

I was assuming not even Bryan would import a Marina (no offense Bryan) added to the fact he used to term re-registering I figured the advice was legit, a cert would be required if fitted before inspection.

Would be an interesting exercise if I did.  All Aussie Marinas had 3-point static belts in the rear, US Marinas had inertia-type 3-point belts in the front and "retracting seatbelts" in the rear.  Is there an age limit for upgrading seatbelts (what has to be done for '60s Mustangs and Chevys)?

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2 hours ago, locost_bryan said:

Would be an interesting exercise if I did.  All Aussie Marinas had 3-point static belts in the rear, US Marinas had inertia-type 3-point belts in the front and "retracting seatbelts" in the rear.  Is there an age limit for upgrading seatbelts (what has to be done for '60s Mustangs and Chevys)?

Yes. It is all laid out in the link above. There are special rules for pre-1979.

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8 hours ago, Ranter said:

My Jap version has a modified floor for 4ws rear end and its rear seatbelts were screwed (self tappers) through floor and bolted through plastic/light metal speaker housings.

I took it through VINZ for WOF's and it passed so asked their advice upon discovering this crude kiwi job, registered now as two seater. I don't see why if its a real expensive pain you can't remove the rear seat. I  assume factory mounts would be there but also recall the scary seatbelt mounting jobs done on early imports so maybe they aren't,

That sounds... safe, haha.

Registering it as a 2-seater has been discussed with one of the compliance places, but the back seat and belts must be permanently removed, and they warned me that any dodginess around re-fitting it would be upon my head if I somehow got caught driving around with people in the back. Also it would look a bit ugly with no back seat, ha.

Anyway, an update on progress: A seatbelt specialist in Tauranga is currently looking into the front belts - if there are drop-in dual sensitive replacements that can be fitted in place of the existing ones, that should pass. The problem is finding a drop-in seatbelt that conforms to the weird as fuck Starion setup.

As for the rear belts - if I fit factory 3-point ones using the factory mounts before compliance, due to a loophole that I didn't bother asking for more clarification about, the inspectors will use those factory mounts and simply fit new dual sensitive belts in their place. However, if the car just turns up with 2-point belts fitted, the inspectors will not bother looking for a factory mount but will instead ask for scratch-built mounts to be fitted and certed.

Confused? I still am, sort of.

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