shizzl Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 i was talking bout a rotor though..and that was from the owner.. father n law used to run his coon on lpg cos it saved a shit load... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemi Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 not to stir shit on that but arent wankels pretty much the most hopesless thermatically efficant due to the hideious cr they use? . i do know they are the ideal engine to run hydrogen but thats another kettle of fish . off to find sweet articles on such things. learning shit i will never use is awesome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twosmoke Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemi Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 ^ excellent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 yea it works out cheaper, just saying its pretty much impossible to be half the cost, if it returned the same economy as petrol this would be true Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 I'm in the process of converting my VG Valiant 265 to dedicated LPG at the moment, so I will just chuck my two cents in. LPG is much higher octane, it is also naturally a gas at room temperature so it mixes more easily with air. It releases less heat when burned than petrol so more LPG has to be burned for a similar result. LPG dosn't make carbon in your engine when burnt, when you change the oil on a dedicated engine it will come out looking as clean as it went in. When you look at LPG systems they are all aftermaket and installed by someone, there for results do vary. Like a petrol fuel system the LPG system has to be matched size wise to the engine, ie A 780cfm Holley is never going to work well on a 4k. LPG systems vary widely in the technology that they use to get the fuel into an engine too which has a big impact on the engines out put and economy. Like wise dual fuel conversions can only be a comprimise, Both fuels require different tuning so best results cannot be achieved. One more point, Only a certified installer can install an LPG system and do the initial certification. For the most part they keep things tied up pretty tight. Like wise with an LPG system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUNAMUCK Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 After doing a bit of reading, I intend to run dedicated LPG on my charger. A worked muscle engine (be it V8 or Hemi 6) is thirsty as fuck! Both a bloke at work's 6 pack hemi pacer, and my old man's 340 V8 valiant destroyed $400 gas going CHCH to Alexandra and back. (About a year ago) While it's uber sweet to have a car that goes like last weeks pay, what good is it when you can never afford to drive it? So after flip flopping for ages, my current line of thinking is a high comp Hemi on Poo gas (Liqufied pootrolium gas) for the charger. Plus with the apropriate mods, you can run blowthrough into an impco LPG mixer. Plus LPG gives 100% atomisation, and the oil last for donkeys! Whilest ther is the small drawback of it generating fewer BTU's that gasoline, the plus's more than make up for it IMO. Plus I've found an Impco 400 mixer set up for a song. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 Yea my 455 will bleed me dry but its only a weekend road tripper, so who cares? the thought of putting it on gas makes me cringe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUNAMUCK Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Me thinks filling the fuel tank will make you cringe more. (In time anyway) Shit I hardly drive my supercharged 1500 due to fuel consumption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RT Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 I've had a couple of LPG falcons with mixed results, this is what I found after years of driving them (and I kept receipts of all money and gas fills for years for business purposes): In my 86 XF 4.1L 6Cyl with an oldschool Impco setup it was reasonable economical to run (for a big car) costing about the same as a 2L petrol corolla. But it was pretty slowish, the LPG needed tune up every now and then (The mixer ends up getting clogged with a wax residue which needs cleaning out etc.) and you had to factor in the costs of an LPG cert, tank certs, LPG warrants. But I had this car when LPG was cheap (2003) I think it was 70c per L. Over the time I had this car the LPG prices rose up to a $1.30 per L (petrol was $1.60) The reason for the LPG price hike was because the govt had a deal with Maui gas fields that they had the approval to mine on the condition of a fixed gas price for 30 years. Unfortunately the 30 years was up during my time with the car LOL and the price rose to global rates. So all and all it wasn't much of a saving in the end I was running a big car for the cost of a smaller one but that was about it. My second car was a 1992 4.0 OHC Falcon with dual fuel. This was a lot faster than the XF. The duel fuel worked perfectly. But in the end if you were highway driving there were virtually NO savings on LPG as you used up far more of it. Around town on LPG had *some* savings if you kept a light foot - but again only in comparison to another car of similar size/weight. If I was to go LPG again it would have to be the latest LPG technology which directly injects liquid LPG into the cylinder, which results in fantastic performance. Now that the LPG prices are subject to global pressures just like petrol, I wouldn't bother with a old LPG mixer system again. The best way to combat fuel prices is to get the best power/weight car and find the money elsewhere to pay for gas: get a higher paying job, give up smoking, don't eat, don't have kids - whatever works for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unclejake Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Me thinks filling the fuel tank will make you cringe more. Spending $3-5k to save $100 a month for a vehicle you will sell soonish would make me cringe even more than watching KKK lick his own balls in a children's sandpit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 ^ Exactly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sholdowa Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Me thinks filling the fuel tank will make you cringe more. Spending $3-5k to save $100 a month for a vehicle you will sell soonish would make me cringe even more than watching KKK lick his own balls in a children's sandpit SWMBO does the books for a garage specialising in LPG. He's giving up because it's impossible to get legal kit reliably ( supplier is on Oz ), and can't import directly. With the new stuff, high mileage motoring was cheaper, with little power loss. But like you say UJ, it's gonna take a hell of a long time to pay for itself... even without the supply problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Comparing an XF to an ED Falcon is like comparing apples and oranges. Add two different gas systems and the compaison becomes impossible. RT when you say an Impco mixer do you mean the regulator on the inner guard? You can build a good LPG system out of second hand parts, Things become difficult when it needs certifying. If you can find a helpfull certifier its not impossible or overly expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubastreet Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 I just had a thought that you could take a normal compression engine and have a solenoid operated supercharger ala Mad Max. On petrol the blower is disabled, but kicks in when you switch over to LPG. No compromise on CR and no worries about running out of gas on a road trip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jase Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 for the people looking into impco stuff, i would emplore you to look at some of gas research's stuff, http://www.gasresearch.com.au/ pretty damn sexy really, i did a fair amount of looking towards gassing my ute and this was what i found to be the most modernised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUNAMUCK Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 With the old school mixers, duel feul is a wank. My old man ran duel fuel on both his XW and his XD work utes. YOu can get it to run okay, on one, and average on the other. I'd just dedicate. A bloke at work is going to give me a complete Impco set up for nix. So I'm only gonna get stung for a tank retest, and a few other incidentals. LPG loves high compression. So An engine built and tuned for gas should go good, and retrun decent mileage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RT Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 RUN - yeah that's what people always told me buy my duel fuel on the 92 EB falcon was very good, ran fine on both fuels. I'd worked the engine somewhat as well. But my point was that on the open road it didn't make any economical sense to use LPG. Valiant - I wasn't actually comparing the two falcons, just making note of my experiences with LPG and yeah Impco mixer on the inner guard. All and all I enjoyed LPG and when it was cheap it was bloody brilliant, but with todays LPG prices I wouldn't bother unless it was a new direct injection system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cletus Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 i had a l300 van once that was lpg dedicated. was ex courier van , had done 450,000km on gas since new, had overheated/blown head gasket/head skim many times. it hauled ass for a shitty old van. probably due to more comp ratio. used to cost round $20 to fill it, got 250km a tank round town, but 400 on open road. this was probably 8 or 9 years ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 RUN - yeah that's what people always told me buy my duel fuel on the 92 EB falcon was very good, ran fine on both fuels. I'd worked the engine somewhat as well. But my point was that on the open road it didn't make any economical sense to use LPG. Valiant - I wasn't actually comparing the two falcons, just making note of my experiences with LPG and yeah Impco mixer on the inner guard. No problens, I misunderstood you. The bit on the inner guard isn't a mixer, its a regulator. More like the float/float bowl on a carburettor. It doesn't meter fuel, it converts liquid to gas. It sounds like your EB had a ring mixer to deliver the fuel. They are pretty crappy, basicly a barbeque element in your air intake that is rolled into a very large venturi. They draw vapour from the regulator but not very accuratly, they get miss matched too. I think that's possibly why the economy was poor. A gas carb is a big step up, not as good as injection but it still meters fuel more accuratly. Kind of like a Stromberg or SU carb does with petrol. Possibly what the XF had? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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