Mattt Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Ok so i'll try and explain this as well as i can As some of you know i have an ms65 crown sedan i'm currently doing an engine conversion on. What you won't know is that i have also just purchased an entire altezza rear end consisting of the subframe, brakes, LSD, arms etc etc so i'm going to mount that in the rear of the crown to run independant rear suspension. The wreckers i was at had an altezza up on the hoist which had Tein adjusties in it as well and the guy did me an ultra sharp deal on them as i wanted to run the rears to make it a bit easier to get ride heights correct etc. However now i want to see if theres a way to make the front coil overs work from the altezza in the front of the crown. So if any suspension gurus can chime in here would be great. I'm thinking about basically removing the old shock and spring and making up a bracket to weld to the lower arm and a bracket to weld to the chassis and mount the coil over however i'm interested to know if because of the way the factory spring sits in between the arms this will mess up geometry or the functionality of it? I mean in my immediate mind i think the way i've described should be fine but i have a bad feeling that i'm missing something here..... does this make sense? essentially what i want to do is what sheepers did with his crown but instead of running bags in the arm and an external shock i just want to run an external coilover shock and spring. Now although i'm not too clued up on the specifics of suspension (hence the question here) i am a qualified fabricator so if it seems possible to those in the know then i will get the advice i need from the certifier etc to make sure it's all done properly etc. cheers in advance. Basic idea of what altezza coilovers look like: sheepers set up: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nominal Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 If you keep the A-arm inner pivots the same, the geometry won't change at all. It might be tricky to get enough clearance for the spring/shock and tyre/wheel at full lock though. I'd suggest pulling the stock spring/shock from one side then mock up the strut and see how it works. You need to get the travel correct too - have the bottom mount the correct distance out from the pivots so you get the full coilover travel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Better off to cut the spring cup out and mount a coil over where the spring/shock live now? Doubt those altezza units will work inside though. You taking the chassis out to mount the rear end? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattt Posted July 24, 2014 Author Share Posted July 24, 2014 Yeah removing the body and all that jazz. It's gonna be a nightmare but fairly confident in being able to achieve it. I was considering a worst case of fabricating new arms but I'd rather not if I can avoid it. I had considered what you suggested Spence and that may be a good way to do it as well but I'lol measure the distance from the pivot point to make sure it comes close to the altezza. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 If it was me I would read some books and be making new arms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Yea to do this not shit you need to look into maybe custom arms and getting the correct coilover that will work in the inboard position. Mounting shocks and springs on the outside of the wishbone like sheepers is the shitty way to go without bags, you have the whole body weight now on those external mounts, the extra diameter of the spring will fuck it up also. Making gear fit because its what you have in this situation is not going to end well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattt Posted July 24, 2014 Author Share Posted July 24, 2014 I like the book idea. I know there's a layman's guide type thing to nz cert rules etc but is there something you would suggest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I can't find a decent picture but to do it decent you want to end up with something like this IMO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Tune to Win by Carrol Smith, and Suspension Geometry and Computation by John C. Dixon. If you can get your head around those two you will be in good stead to make your suspension do what you want. This tread looks good http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=326355 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 What rookie is saying is build custom front chassis rails and fit a mustang 2 front end haha. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 That would be the easiest hahaha http://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/clp-201-2200-00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Then you get the added bonus that a 302w bolts straight in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Fuck it! I was going to say the upside is that you can chuck a 289 in it, too slow. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I do enjoy how we have got old enough that the easy/expensive option is now a viable one just because of the time saved hahaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattt Posted July 24, 2014 Author Share Posted July 24, 2014 1: I'd die before sticking a Ford v8 in my car 2: ideally this should be a cheap but fabrication focused project. Time spent is fine. Money spent is not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 You could fit in a 308 then since you are a Ford hater. If you are serious measure your existing shocks and if the Altezza coilovers are longer sell them. Then chop out the spring cup and make something work like that picture above. Decide if fixing the shitty geometry when lowered is on the cards, if so change the mounting points and make some tubular arms. Is this going to be a crown race car or something? if you want to change the height all the time coilovers are a PITA, get some bags. Otherwise just get some springs in the rate/height you want and roll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattt Posted July 25, 2014 Author Share Posted July 25, 2014 No holden junk either thanks. Not race car. Just a good handling road car that I may do the odd classic car event in. I'm not looking to change the height all the time. Its just that having the coilovers for the rear anyway I thought if I could get the fronts to work too would allow me to fine tune the cars height easily and effectively and probably help get the ride right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 To do it legit its lots of work for not much. Cut some factory springs to the height you want, get all the proper measurements (installed height is usually the biggie) then get some custom springs. As a old man though I would keep the F series live axle also haha, so learn some shit and give it a go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spencer Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Actually you should just go straight to bags, ask sheepers. It will ride/drive way better than any coilover setup for just highway drivingl, plus you get to lay it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattt Posted July 25, 2014 Author Share Posted July 25, 2014 That's the plan man. Most of what I'm doing is to learn rather than to get massive results. I'll check out some books and do the research but so far it seems like there's nothing really stopping it from working so that was the main point. Watch this space....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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